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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2013 12:17 am 
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Gents, someone PM'd me recently and asked me what I meant when I said 'push-ups' in one of my posts. Not that they didn't know already, but I think they just wanted to compare what I was doing vs. what they were doing out of curiousity, 'cause my posts indicate that my way of seeing things is similar to theirs. While we should all find our own paths, I still saw some merit to this. So I figured, rather than reply to their PM, I would start a new thread specifically for push-ups. Not only could others chime in and say what they do differently (and all of us would then have a wider base of techniques to check out, all assembled in one place), but the more seasoned guys could also contribute and/or advise with their wealth of experience/expertise (no pressure - you obviously don't have to if you don't want to).

I'm still a little reluctant about this, since it may lead to the expectation of 'hand-holding', which goes against the fundamental principles of what this forum is trying to achieve. And I appreciate that everyone's thoughts on push-ups are already posted in threads throughout the forum, so all we need to do is Search. So 'Grinus: if you feel it necessary, feel free to close this thread so that replies cannot be posted.

So anyway, onto my answer:

Specifically, by 'mental pushups', I am referring to:

http://www.naturalfreedom.info/viewtopi ... &view=next
I try to take the time to 'watch my mind' during meditation in the manner described for roughly 30 mins, and do this once or twice a day. If I miss a day or 2, no probs (I try not to be too hard on myself because this leads to 'burnout'). And every once in a while, when I want to deal with a specific issue with my 'shadow' (ie the buttons that people can press to reaaaally piss me off or make me feel insecure, etc.), then I visualise the worst example of such a situation (not too exaggerated, though - I feel that FOR ME it has to be realistic) as soon as I start the meditation, and just 'watch my mind' as usual.

And also, another thing I do is referred to in my post in this thread: http://www.naturalfreedom.info/viewtopi ... 640#p24968. And specifically, this is how I both monitor and encourage myself about my improvements in self-observation:
Quote:
noticing incremental improvements in my "response time" (i.e. the time it takes between when I bristle and when I RECOGNISE that I am bristling) encourages me to improve (without really making a helluva lot of effort).
And finally, this is an experiment I tried, with outstanding results: http://www.naturalfreedom.info/viewtopi ... 865#p27873. I plan to return to this every now & again. However, rather than enforce a 'distraction blackout' for 4-6 weeks again, i'm thinking that I may intensify it/reduce the period of time by simply staying at home by myself with no distractions (no activities like reading, websurfing, listening to music, etc.) for an entire weekend. I'd do this, I dunno, every couple of months or so; i'll refine my method as I go along....

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2013 12:27 am 
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roark wrote:
And finally, this is an experiment I tried, with outstanding results: http://www.naturalfreedom.info/viewtopi ... 865#p27873. I plan to return to this every now & again. However, rather than enforce a 'distraction blackout' for 4-6 weeks again, i'm thinking that I may intensify it/reduce the period of time by simply staying at home by myself with no distractions (no activities like reading, websurfing, listening to music, etc.) for an entire weekend. I'd do this, I dunno, every couple of months or so; i'll refine my method as I go along....
Clarification: however, to this day I still DO NOT play music in my car, at least during the day. You know how if you happen to walk around the corner to the store or something you realise that you notice much more detail than if you drive to the same place? Well, without music in the car, I find I notice the same amount of detail while driving. The other types of 'push-ups' that I do may be contributing to this, though.......

If driving at night, I may still play music in the car. Or I may not......

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2013 12:44 am 
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@ Roark, nice!!

It's all cumulative in my perspective. Everything builds upon itself. We are building house with a reinforced foundation 1 brick at a time.

Things will hit you from time to time, but with your progress, you'll RECOGNIZE it and it will further solidify your mindset.

For example, I'll be in conversation with people & shit that I read on this board pops up in my head in the moment.

The one today is something I read that G posted about how women speak indirectly & listen to the melody of her tune not the exact words.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2013 12:52 am 
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AlexJ wrote:
The one today is something I read that G posted about how women speak indirectly & listen to the melody of her tune not the exact words.
Niiiiice!!

I had an experience a few months back where a total stranger came up to me and started a conversation. On the surface it was totally banal (I mean, what she was saying was totally meaningless, I shit you not). But yet there was an exchange of some kinda energy and my body was tingling. After we parted ways, I felt totally relaxed & yet rejuvinated, and my mind felt totally at peace and contented.

One of the most beautiful moments of my life. (Edit: hers too, i'll wager.)

Final edit (promise :lol: ): I think this is an example of what some spiritual teachers refer to as getting to know someone beneath the words & labels - while we were talking (she did the majority.....), I was getting the feeling as though our 'real selves' were getting to know one another, but because the actual contents of the conversation were so trivial (and random, and totally pointless) we ended up not finding out anything about one another (ooops - I mean one another's 'personas')

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2013 7:11 am 
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Just went through some of my other posts to see if I left anything out, and it seems I did:

From http://www.naturalfreedom.info/viewtopi ... =18&t=2929, the relevant part is:
Quote:
I have been in "observation mode" for a few months now. Every once in a while, I like to sit in public areas and alternate between 1) observing people (not just hot women, but ALL women and ALL men, as well as children), 2) clearing my mind by focusing on an object (a poster, sign, plant, anything) without thinking for 30 seconds to a minute (I NEVER imagined that it could be possible to be "without thought" even for a few seconds, but there you go!), and 3) reading.

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"I will not grow in the light, until I pass through the darkest caverns of my heart..."

"Temet Nosce"


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 26, 2013 3:15 am 
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Location: The side of a mountain somewhere...
Hmm... Pushups for me have consisted of:

1) Observation - easy to do on other people, harder to truly observe yourself, but very worthwhile. Meditation/quiet sitting are good ways to observe yourself, in addition to seeing how you are triggered/react in "real life".

2) Analysis - pretty much can't help do this after focusing on observation.

3) Reading - here, at the balls project, books, etc. Then analysis of reading.

Bout sums it up for me...

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"The society gives you a map; I give you only freedom. The society gives you character, I give you only consciousness. The society teaches you to live a conformist life ... I give you an invitation to go on an adventure." - Osho


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 26, 2013 3:55 am 
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Fellas...when fufe pops back up with his drivel...do us ALL a favor and just SPAM THIS LINK in response...that and LITTLE ELSE. :ugeek:

Thanks 8-)

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 26, 2013 6:05 am 
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I figured that sooner or later you would say something like this :lol: .

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 26, 2013 8:15 am 
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The Kidd!! wrote:
Fellas...when fufe pops back up with his drivel...do us ALL a favor and just SPAM THIS LINK in response...that and LITTLE ELSE. :ugeek:

Thanks 8-)
Hahaha what an ASS a very good ass for him.

Hahaha.

Medicine!

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2013 3:04 am 
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I just realised that I neglected what is, in my opinion, one of the most important aspects of push-ups:

THE MAIN PURPOSE OF PUSH-UPS IS NOT TO ENABLE ME TO ACHIEVE THE CORRECT MINDSET TO GET LAID A LOT/GET A GIRLFRIEND/GET A FUCKBUDDY/HAVE A LOT OF WOMEN ADMIRE ME. IN FACT, THE GOAL HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE FEMALE GENDER AT ALL.

IT IS TO GET ME COMFORTABLE WITH MYSELF, MORE AT EASE IN MY BODY, MORE AWARE OF THE TRUTH & TRUE NATURE OF THE ENVIRONMENT IN WHICH I FUNCTION, MORE AWARE OF MYSELF AT THE DEEPEST LEVELS, AND THEREFORE MORE AWARE OF WHAT I NEED TO WORK ON.

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"I will not grow in the light, until I pass through the darkest caverns of my heart..."

"Temet Nosce"


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2013 9:29 am 
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roark wrote:
I just realised that I neglected what is, in my opinion, one of the most important aspects of push-ups:

THE MAIN PURPOSE OF PUSH-UPS IS NOT TO ENABLE ME TO ACHIEVE THE CORRECT MINDSET TO GET LAID A LOT/GET A GIRLFRIEND/GET A FUCKBUDDY/HAVE A LOT OF WOMEN ADMIRE ME. IN FACT, THE GOAL HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE FEMALE GENDER AT ALL.

IT IS TO GET ME COMFORTABLE WITH MYSELF, MORE AT EASE IN MY BODY, MORE AWARE OF THE TRUTH & TRUE NATURE OF THE ENVIRONMENT IN WHICH I FUNCTION, MORE AWARE OF MYSELF AT THE DEEPEST LEVELS, AND THEREFORE MORE AWARE OF WHAT I NEED TO WORK ON.
[ img ]

Ever woke up in the mornign all cozy in your blankets and for whatever mission of life you feel like THE motherfucker dude, balanced ALL day for whatever reason?.

Welllll, I'm beggining to feel that, by forgiving myself, indulging myself and expressing that; but automaticaly because it's a byproduct of feeling GOOOOD with myself.

How's that for the record?

The meaning of becoming your bestfiend, is to BECOMING your bestfirend.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2013 4:01 pm 
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Dali wrote:
The meaning of becoming your bestfiend, is to BECOMING your bestfirend.
Exactly! I would replace 'meaning' with 'purpose', although the use of the word meaning is fine in this context. Purpose just resonates a bit more with me.

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"I will not grow in the light, until I pass through the darkest caverns of my heart..."

"Temet Nosce"


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2013 5:50 pm 
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Here's an analogy I'd use:

Both push ups (real inner work) and eating junk food ("inner work" with an external goal in mind, i.e. women) will make your chest bigger. Only one is a solid foundation though, and only one makes you stronger in the end.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2013 6:01 pm 
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moose35 wrote:
Here's an analogy I'd use:

Both push ups (real inner work) and eating junk food ("inner work" with an external goal in mind, i.e. women) will make your chest bigger. Only one is a solid foundation though, and only one makes you stronger in the end.
http://www.naturalfreedom.info/viewtopi ... 00&p=19146
Working link of the image :
http://ww1.sinaimg.cn/bmiddle/6ed7a9a7j ... ol5g4j.jpg

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 1:32 pm 
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roark wrote:
THE MAIN PURPOSE OF PUSH-UPS [...] IS TO GET ME COMFORTABLE WITH MYSELF, MORE AT EASE IN MY BODY, MORE AWARE OF THE TRUTH & TRUE NATURE OF THE ENVIRONMENT IN WHICH I FUNCTION, MORE AWARE OF MYSELF AT THE DEEPEST LEVELS, AND THEREFORE MORE AWARE OF WHAT I NEED TO WORK ON.
roark wrote:
Dali wrote:
The meaning of becoming your bestfiend, is to BECOMING your bestfirend.
Exactly! I would replace 'meaning' with 'purpose', although the use of the word meaning is fine in this context. Purpose just resonates a bit more with me.
I disagree with you Mr roark. (again it might be a projection of mine, whatever, even if he who shall learn from this might only be me later on, it will still be valuable)

'meaning of' resonates with me as intellectual meaning, learning, KNOWING, UNDERSTANDING.

'purpose" resonates with me as implication of Effort, "WORK", Actions, to achieve an END

So, purpose to me means there is an END to achieve and doing things can help, while meaning means that you have to 'understand something' only to enjoy the JOURNEY.

"He who understands the Tao in the morning, can die in peace in the evening".


Grinus touching this : http://www.naturalfreedom.info/viewtopi ... 1520#p1520

I could go on estra lengths for nothing, so I'll stop there.

BTW : I'm just nitpicking because I said I wouldn't up your threads but I felt this one was worth more attention for newcomers :lol:

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 19, 2013 5:41 am 
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Something additional that I have been doing lately, and don't think i've mentioned before: I started keeping a journal, recording any discoveries I make about myself as I go along. I will elaborate on this below, but I wanted to add this to this thread because it seems that writing "letters to my childhood self" about any roots of self-loathing, anger, neediness etc. that I come across in my self-exploration seems to somehow ease the burden a bit, and makes things more clear, as opposed to if I just kept it in my mind.

*****WARNING: A ROARK RAMBLE IS ABOUT TO COMMENCE:*****

I have once again been experimenting with temporarily removing, from my life, the distractions most precious to me, that are my 'lifeline' (primarily music, but other stuff as well). And also secluding myself away from everyone for a couple of days every now & again, when I have the opportunity. The results have been most interesting: Last time I did this I was able to trace back to the roots (in my childhood) of my neediness. This time around, I have found some very surprising and unlikely 'culprits' in my past, that appear to be at the roots of why certain specific situations or behaviours from people make me feel anger to the point where it feels like i'm trying to keep a lid on an atom bomb. Both times the causes found were far different than, and totally unrelated to, what I had previously assumed.

Knowing the cause doesn't magically stop the pain or the resulting compulsive reactions. But the nice thing is that I can now, whenever I am present enough to put a little space between myself and the reaction, recognise that I felt these violent reactions to these situations (or ones analogous to these) when I was a little boy FOR A GOOD REASON (survival, not being large enough or old enough to defend myself effectively, etc.), but that these reasons NO LONGER APPLY. I have actually been writing sorta letters to my childhood self, in a journal, exploring and feeling through this stuff as I stumble upon it, and forgiving my (childhood) self for feeling this way for the reasons above.

In these letters, I also forgive anyone involved in these situations that caused me pain in my childhood, recognising their unconsciousness (and where possible also recognising or at least acknowledging how their unconsciousness was learned from others), and also sometimes recognising how their own unconsciousness has affected the quality of their own life (no sense hating them or holding them responsible for my 'trauma' or anything like that; we're basically all in the same boat, even if i'm the only one actively searching for a life raft :mrgreen: ). Sometimes when I start writing, a whole torrent of related stuff that I didn't expect comes rushing through my mind, and it becomes extremely difficult for my pencil to keep up with what my mind is producing in terms of additional facts and scenarios related to what has just been revealed. Once i've finished writing, I feel as though i've taken significant steps in the process of coming to terms with myself (although some of that feeling probably comes from my ego, but who gives a fuck anyway? :lol: )

Hey, maybe i'm becoming my own shrink! :mrgreen:

It seems that extricating myself from my 'life', even in a somewhat limited way - i'm still otherwise working, going to engagements when they come up, etc. - brings up the real shit. Imagine what would float to the surface if I were placed in the situation fufe proposed (http://www.naturalfreedom.info/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=3186), FOR AN EXTENDED PERIOD OF TIME?
fufe wrote:
"If I was left somewhere alone, without my family, friends, coworkers, acquitances, my job, my career, my distractions... Who would I be ?"
Going deeper down the rabbit hole with this (with the help of TS Eliot and Joseph Conrad): if this went on indefinitely, now that you have nothing left to fall back on but what YOU have made of yourSELF, would you succumb to madness (the hollow man) or freedom (solid to the fucking core)?

[Take care of yourSELF. That is ultimately all we are ever guaranteed to have. It may also be all we will ever need.]

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"Temet Nosce"


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 19, 2013 6:12 am 
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Well...at least he gives warnings now. 8-)

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 19, 2013 1:42 pm 
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The Kidd!! wrote:
Well...at least he gives warnings now. 8-)
:lol: :lol:

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 19, 2013 2:59 pm 
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If what you wrote accurately portrays your experiences roark, then you know what you now know.

Enjoy the journey.

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In building a statue, a sculptor doesn't keep adding clay to his subject.He keeps chiseling away at the inessentials until the truth of its creation is revealed without obstructions. Perfection is not when there is no more to add,but no more to take away.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 26, 2013 3:09 am 
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roark wrote:
It seems that extricating myself from my 'life', even in a somewhat limited way - i'm still otherwise working, going to engagements when they come up, etc. - brings up the real shit
Very true!
Take away the distractions and the truth comes out.

I enjoyed reading your purpose statement for pushup. :mrgreen:


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