Natural Freedom

Since I've been young, i have always been naturally more intelligent than other people (though not on the level of Albert Einstein ) and thus things that most people takes time to understand, i comprehend immediately or shortly. Unfortunately there is one exception: relationships, which is due to my lack of experience. Since childhood until 8th grade, i focused purely on studying and having fun, and 9th grade to 10th grade, i was focused on getting friends (i went to a new highschool every year except 11th and 12th grade due to my parents). Now, i have improved my friend making skills, but due to my lack of experience compared to anyone in my age, i fail at dating. I have yet to get a girlfriend. I have gotten close, but failed due to being to sympish and clingy (damn the past me!!).

This brings me to my main point: Whenever there is a question i wish to post on this forum, its answered immediately by me. If i was someone that was experienced and all that, then i wouldn't have second thoughts. However, as of now, despite changing my mindset (which btw made my life less stressful and simple), my progress on relationships have barely increased. Sure, more girls are attracted to me now, but i have never gone further than close friends. Thus, I'm worried that my answers are all wrong. Has this or is this happening to anyone else right now?

On a side note, this is something i just wish to confirm:
an indifferent person takes action without attachment to results.
an apathetic person does not take action or have any attachments.
Correct?

Par for the course at our age ...as Kidd always says our time will come

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"The heart is deep beyond all things, and it is the man. Even so, who can know him."

The problem with answering your own questions is that there is no blank slate answering this personal ramblings, maybe most of the times the answer comes from a place of that is plagued by insecurities and more often than not is incorrect because of the false biases it holds as true. (If you continue here and properly observe you'll see a pattern emerge: DIG DEEP)

Just ponder on this: If your own answers were correct you wouldn't be here asking such questions, right? The problem with this relies on the notion that one "feel as he knows" everything because the correlation of intelectual intelligence, but put this in a perspective of relationships and the emotional one is; divergent, so what you have to focus is in your emotions (relationships are fully charged with this shit) so even if you knew the answer intellectualy, emotionally you are not so strong to put it to test, that's why the more advanced members in here strongly advocate to get in touch with your "demons" (insecurity issues, emotional baggage, INTERNAL SHIT). And then once confronting your own issues, you would be able to logically analize every situation without the white noise of emotions (far more powerful than logic). And then you'll develop an intuition for every chance you have to interact with people, and will read them because you read yourself first, and you "know" yourself.

An indifferent person doesn't care about results, for them it's allways the same; and enjoys the process/journey.
The apathetic one, does not enjoy the process nor interests him, and maybe once in a while care about the results.

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GMST

Oh yeah man. Having the correct answer = higher scores and more success and is ingrained from a young age. There are many professions where this applies as well.

This is territory that is more about being in presence - there, in the moment and acting without a preconceived idea. Women react to a man and who he is being, not who has the right answers or does things "correct" like there is some order. Some guys here will do what externally seems like the same exact thing but have very different results in terms of women because it is not chemistry where a machine can put the same ingredients in and get the same results.

You will even do this with concepts like indifference for a while. Ok so indifference means i do and think this way, leads to these results etc which is another form of "getting the answer".

The question is not about getting a better answer. Its the part (safety) that operates like there IS an answer. There is no answer and nothing is correct or wrong. That is freedom. And it's scary as hell to most people because now you have no external parameters for anything - its all on your ass to define yourself and world and live by it- consequences and all.

Edit: I mean no preconceived answer to a situation. It arises in the moment and if you think you already know you will not listen to that part that gives you the answer and operate from the one in your head. Think pickup artist type who will run the same lines and process because they "understand how it works" and not reading the situation where it could be totally unnecessary to say anything - or a futile pursuit in the first place

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zTXz8xMaJi4

Dali is right on.

Intellect is amazingly powerful at giving reasons to not dig deep and to prevent from going in and dealing with demons and emotions. "I understand it." I understand how muscle building works but it has nothing to do with lifting weights. Don't think about indifference, do the work

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zTXz8xMaJi4

Just wanted to say : I'm the exact opposite of you in this, I always focused on relationships as much as I could and didn't really study anything hard, I'm not really intelligent or talented either..

you're only 3-4 years older than me but seems much more experienced. For some reason, i don't understand what you mean by "par for the course" I am waiting for that day tho

@Dali this is a really well written post. I'll just take certain quotes that i don't completely understand. In other words, my intelligence, or rather the side effects of intelligence, is actually a hindrance when it comes to relationships?

I believe that I'm already in touch with my demons. This is mostly due to the fact that they aren't that large. Unlike many members of this forum, my life was never that messed up. I lived in a family with an alpha male father, we've never had any problems, and even though the amount of friends, close or not, varied throughout my life, i never considered myself lonely. Once i was depressed, but that merely due to having way too much free time (once i joined a sports club, it went away). The only issue that plagues me is insecurity (and only relationship-wise), which is due to no experience. I also know that the only way to cure this insecurity is by getting experience. Quite a vicious cycle.
This is a bit confusing. So what you're saying is, when i accept myself, I'll be able to separate my emotions and logic, instead of just suppressing my emotions? Also by doing this, i will develop the instincts to read other people? In terms of reading people, i believe that i'm rather good at that, in that i'm usually correct on what they think consciously or subconsciously. However, it has not yet become instinctive for me. I only realize a few minutes after the interaction or when i have some free time; i can't read in real-time. I guess i still have to practice my observation skills.

@Flow83 So you're talking about only the actual interaction. When i say that i answer my own questions, i was also thinking about other things (questions about values, space, etc). However, i still understand what you're saying. The "correct" answer depends on the person you're interacting with. Its something that just requires experience (at both freedom and relationships) to actually do. In other words, when you become proficient, you have no need to listen to the voices in your head and just rely purely on instincts?

Understand that the mind always gives your own answer because that is what minds do. No exceptions - its not because you are particularly gifted, sorry. Everyone gets their own answer because the mind cannot leave a question open which is why good work uses the mind to go beyond it.

The answer for plenty of people to every question is "because god made it that way." everyone gets an answer - it depends on where the answer is coming from. It is a damn good thing people challenged the standard answers and most importantly their own in order to find the truth even though this literally got them killed sometimes. That is why you need to cut through the whitenoise as Dali put it. Everyone also tends to think their answer is a little smarter or better than everyone else's, including the wackiest Scientology answer to what is really going on to the guy who has an iq so he knows better (I am top percentile in terms of intelligence tests and this was hands down the worst thing for relationships for me because of exactly what I described above).

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Instinct yes to an extent but this does not rule out knowledge or gained experience it is just dealing with what is directly in front of you and responding from all of these resources rather than the "answer" you come in with.

Ask a guy who ski jumps on mountains with no trails how much "thinking" he can do or how much listening to the voices he can do before he's dead. The body and nervous system micro adjusts in billions of ways to literally billions of pieces of information. It is infinitely more intelligent than your "intelligence" and the more you interact with life and other people from that "zone" the more it operates. This does not negate learning and development of skill it is the middle balance of both. Like most intelligent people you are vastly imbalanced in one direction (which has served you well for many things in society) else there would not be these questions and blocks in relating.

This one you can't solve the way you can other problems which is why many smart people just never deal with it and stay socially fucked up because they can still do "fine" in the world without it.
But dealing will be one of the best things you ever do.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zTXz8xMaJi4

Btw intelligence is equally good at justifying and explaining it away. Oh it's just this or that - I dont have time for it, it's beneath me it's shallow etc. I *could* do it if I wanted to.

These are all things to watch out for. They are delusions not looking at the fact that in the end the guy is without quality relationships with other men and without sex and connection with women.

Edit obviously from the tone of your question you are self aware and
on the path it is just something to watch out for slipping back into when the shit gets real in terms of looking at the demons etc

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zTXz8xMaJi4

More like if, you only "think" but don't properly analyse where this thinking (presuposition) is coming from. And we've talked about where the ideas are coming from.
You are here for a reason, just discover it for yourself. This I cannot tell you. It's ok, some illusory monsters are bigger for some people, and for some other are to a lesser extent, seemingly inofensive. Do not take this shit for granted, as I say earlier dig deep.

For the later about experience and insecurity; If you are balanced internally this will preceed the experience. Calling it otherway; the experience you'll have externally will be a mirror of your internal state. You have this backwards, I know that there is lots of things that you could and can learn externally like the interactions and subtleties about behavior and other cool things about interpersonal relationships. But just reframe this; you feel insecure because you don't have experience but it's the other way around, when you do the challenging work of questioning all your assumptions about relationships and then confront this issues, you'll see that is not an external thing but more like a change of an internal paradigm.

... Actually I'm working in this right now.
Some members call it here: "switch between logic and emotion". When you shift to logical mode it'll not be so much ego to get in your way. Ego in the form of a discursive mental parroting, like removing your own golum of LOTR inside your head; it will be more silence and acceptance, flow and enjoyment. And plenty of time time to analyse the situation without feeling: shit, over attached, rushed, emotionally unbalanced, & victimhood biased. You will see the things as they are without your protective radioactive suit (maybe some bitter pills you have to swallow) and you would be able to work from this place, it's like having your desk cleanly organized and easily accesible, so work gets done quicker and more efficently (although some people work in a mess and do wonders ) just to ilustrate the point.

Also, you'll have to put your part. Do not expect some magicall powers bathing over you like a sayian if you accept and know yourself, it'll just make the work FAR easier. Here, we never stop practicing our observation skills, some swords are sharper, some are little bit dull but in the end we all keep practicing. I endorse you to do the same.

TheKidd!! Had an old signature in his posts, that was something like this:
"Logic is the training wheel for the intuition"

Hope it helps.

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GMST

Alright thanks for answering Flow83 and Dali. It seems i should try inner works when i get some free time.

Of course it's good to have time to sit down and dig in, but at least a few of the things Dali talked about can be applied or practiced just about anywhere. It can be as simple as reminding yourself to do it.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zTXz8xMaJi4

Sorry but i can't see anything Dali said that can be applied immediately. All his advice requires a bit of digging before they can be used.

You can question assumptions and conclusions any time they arise -- the moment they happen. The conclusion that there was nothing here that can be applied immediately is a great one to start with

You have to question your 'answers' until you become very attuned to whether it's just a concept or mental/emotional bullshit giving you the answer or if it is truly arising from your 'gut' and knowing. It can be questioned very logically (the way he described it ie separating logic from emotion, if I am understanding him correctly), anywhere, any time.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zTXz8xMaJi4

Ah alright i see. Thanks for pointing that out.

@royalon

Listen to your gut. It's 80-90% of what you have to do.

Often times, your gut feeling is correct.

The feeling generally comes as a sensation. If you pay attention well you'll also form quick thoughts that link like a web. Before you know it, with practice, you'll be able to verbalize that web.

It's just the way it is, tide comes in tide goes out sun rises sun sets..bitches front

They know they have lots of options so they're very passive. As they start to get older, they come to realize there time is past and they cannot compete with 20 year olds. So they start to act right. Or so I hear

That's right about the time most guys clout reaches critical mass. It's in Kidd's Korner.

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"The heart is deep beyond all things, and it is the man. Even so, who can know him."