Natural Freedom

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In building a statue, a sculptor doesn't keep adding clay to his subject.He keeps chiseling away at the inessentials until the truth of its creation is revealed without obstructions. Perfection is not when there is no more to add,but no more to take away.

Hmmm....

First thread I've ever seen you make that hasn't gotten at least 10 replies. Once again, you excel at perplexing me.

I haven't had a chance to read the thread, but I'm interested because of the title.

Narcissism is a double-edged sword.

This is what I grew up dealing with...narcissistic mother syndrome.

http://parrishmiller.com/narcissists.html

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EVERYTHING in life is conditional...EVERYTHING.

Pimposophy Revisited is now finally available on Amazon in all territories!

Kidd, my mentor grew up with a legitimately psychotic (and also from the sounds of it narcissistic) mother -- he actually has discussed on video what happened when he finally, fully confronted this internally.

I bring this up because it is interesting how you both would have this, and both, though coming from different places/perspectives 'see' dynamics going on very clearly and are able to summarize entire sentiments of a dynamic/relationship/discussion thread in a short sentence. There is actually a very clear connection to this to me- which btw full credit to both for actually processing it instead of running. No reason to go into it here but it is very interesting and several light bulbs for me.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zTXz8xMaJi4

My mom laid the subconscious groundwork for my mindset...my life experiences are what brought it to the forefront and honed them to a razor sharp edge. As much as I hate to admit it, it's probably thanks to her that I'm as intuitive as I am.

Coincidentally...the way to break from a narcissistic mother's grasp is to become completely indifferent to her...what she thinks/feels doesn't matter to me in the slightest. She could die right now and I could truly care less...sure I'll put on a good show so that people don't think I'm Dexter Morgan or whatever, but deep down inside, if I feel anything...it will be relief.

Oh and also become your own man as soon as humanly possible...where you don't need her for SHIT.

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EVERYTHING in life is conditional...EVERYTHING.

Pimposophy Revisited is now finally available on Amazon in all territories!

I have a very similar situation to Kidd. I think he said something along the lines of "My mother was a great provider, but a shitty mother" (correct me if I'm wrong, oh mighty one). Well, even when my mother did provide for me, it was conditional and bound to get her angry in a couple of hours because I didn't worship her feet for getting me something.

I honestly thought that I was the crazy one, especially with my whole family looking strangely at me and calling me ungrateful when I started questioning certain things. But somebody on here sent me a PM saying my parents, especially my mother, might be narcissistic, I read a shitload of books about the subject, and voila, they are.

I sent my parents a couple of links (including the one Kidd posted), pointing out their behavior in the examples of a narcissistic parent's behavior, and they got hella angry, stopped talking to me, and our relationship has been as rocky as can be ever since.

I am slowly breaking the chains, but am still far away from being indifferent to their opinions and demands. Any advice on that Kidd? Did something shift where you said "fuck it", or was it a slow gradual process of facing fears and such?

I feel really guilty admitting that I probably wouldn't feel anything if my mother died. But shit, it is what it is.


PS: To give you an example - Yesterday, I went to buy a birthday present for my mom. I even told her, because I couldn't think of a good enough excuse to take out my bike in rainy weather - she told me to change from my pajamas, I said I really don't feel like it. She asked me if I don't care what people will think if I have pajamas on outside, I said not really. She asked me if I was so careless as to let people see her son dressed so poorly, reflecting on her image so badly. I laughed and left. She screamed, as I was closing the door, that I didn't need to buy her the present, because she won't get any happiness from it now that I've done this.

This shit happens either obviously or subtly quite a few times a day. Realizing this has given me a bit more compassion in dealing with my inner issues.

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Take it easy, man. But take it.

You quoted me correctly...except I said it in first person because I actually told her that to her face...it was a very cathartic and memorable moment for me.

How to become completely indifferent to your parents? You just say, 'Fuck it' and mean it. Don't worry, they'll do all the heavy lifting and ammunition supplying...all you have to do is make the decision not to allow them to have any power over your life. Stop looking at them as parents and more like non-related acquaintances...see if that helps. It's all about reframing the picture.

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EVERYTHING in life is conditional...EVERYTHING.

Pimposophy Revisited is now finally available on Amazon in all territories!

and self-improvement gurus try to say that our past dont determine our future.

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“Everything can be taken from a man but one thing: the last of the human freedoms—to choose one’s attitude in any given set of circumstances, to choose one’s own way.” Viktor E. Frankl

It DOESN'T determine it...just can greatly INFLUENCE it.

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EVERYTHING in life is conditional...EVERYTHING.

Pimposophy Revisited is now finally available on Amazon in all territories!

oh no

what will now do all the guys who want to become 'tight' but were grew up in a pathological family?!

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“Everything can be taken from a man but one thing: the last of the human freedoms—to choose one’s attitude in any given set of circumstances, to choose one’s own way.” Viktor E. Frankl

It depends on what you make from it. Either you let it bother you, or you accept it, learn from the lessons and appreciate the things that it gave you (Me, for example, I can read people like a book and can generally tell if something's bothering them or if they're acting dishonestly/putting on a mask. It's because I had to cater to my parent's whims, so the circumstances suck, but it's a good skill to have in sales and teaching - my 2 fields of work).

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Take it easy, man. But take it.

And another thing - If the situation at my house wasn't as dysfunctional as it is, I highly doubt I'd ever start seeing the matrix and consider changing. It was an impulse, for sure.

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Take it easy, man. But take it.

I concur. My own mother is narcissistic, but she is also vitriolic and seems to almost enjoy causing other people anguish and emotional suffering. Probably something about how other people should have to go through emotional suffering, since she had to go through so much of it after her first husband (who she was very infatuated with) was murdered after just 8 months of being married.

See here: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2584

I was very angry at her for a very long time. Now I mostly just pity her.

And my family life definitely made me seek out an investigate the truth of the matrix, and made me accept it quickly once I saw it. Even from a very early age I just had this gut doubt about everything the matrix was telling me.

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"The society gives you a map; I give you only freedom. The society gives you character, I give you only consciousness. The society teaches you to live a conformist life ... I give you an invitation to go on an adventure." - Osho

Guess it was a blessing in disguise, eh?

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EVERYTHING in life is conditional...EVERYTHING.

Pimposophy Revisited is now finally available on Amazon in all territories!

Yes sir. It took a long time to see it as that, but now I agree.

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"The society gives you a map; I give you only freedom. The society gives you character, I give you only consciousness. The society teaches you to live a conformist life ... I give you an invitation to go on an adventure." - Osho

What if we are not propelled from the past
but attracted from the future(?) It´s inevitable
to be the you, who you now are.

Then, anything negative in our past is the very same
as if it never happened.

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Kidd, no offense man but psychologically speaking wouldn't you say that it's a healthier mindset to distance yourself from someone who is suffering from a mental disorder and hope they get better as opposed to being happy that they are dead.To me it's sounds kind of harsh.

I know im jumping in, but he didnt say what it sounds like you are interpreting what he said.

Also how you feel about someone or something is what it is. You are not "supposed" to want certain things for certain people. Forced compassion because its "right" is bullshit, and not much healthier than holding in mind angry thoughts about people (which he is not doing). This is not - I wish you were dead.

What's healthy is to allow yourself to feel the way you do without judging it based on how others might perceive it, and let the person/situation be what it is.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zTXz8xMaJi4

The world is harsh, Caliboy...deal with it.

_________________
EVERYTHING in life is conditional...EVERYTHING.

Pimposophy Revisited is now finally available on Amazon in all territories!

this thread is another example that dealing with 'parents past' is important key to 'grow up'.

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“Everything can be taken from a man but one thing: the last of the human freedoms—to choose one’s attitude in any given set of circumstances, to choose one’s own way.” Viktor E. Frankl