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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 6:23 pm 
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I'm going to try and be brief here so I may miss out a few things, but a nice little eye opener has called me thus;

In 2012 I was with a girl for 6 months. First 2 months were great(when I was totally indifferent), and then when she started demanding MOAR, things changed. I naturally declined her invitations of co-habitation and demands to meet my whoke fuckin' family :lol: But I kept her on anyway in spite of my better judgement; such was my enslavement to the penis and sympish need for companionship!

Not going to lie; I wasn't always tight during these months, and the inner symp surfaced at the last. In GENERAL, however, I was ok. Sex was through the roof, but as the months went on she realised I wasn't going to give anywhere near what she wanted - to be the centre of my world, family, financial stability, to be treated like a princess - the usual.

Eventually she got bored(her words) and left me. My reaction was a little loose to say the least. Anyhow, within weeks she was with another guy(who, incidentally, paid for her to go on holiday with him within weeks of dating). I reasoned that I didn't really have any true grievances with her, despite a bruised ego.

We met up a few months later, whereby she disclosed that her sex life was like the Antarctic wildnerness. As a joke I emailed her and offered, in the name of friendship, one night only of some good lovin'. She took it much more seriously than I presumed she would, and respectfully declined, probably with a facial expression like this :|

I laugh it off, we part ways, I TOTALLY FORGET about her.

A year goes by. She's broken up with her BF, who over the course of their year together proved himself to be a wreck of a man and yada yada yada. She's broke and homeless. So I get the text;

'Can I take you up on that one night offer?'

:roll:

'I'll consider it''.

Naturally I'm suspicious, but I am just too damn curious about people and I reason to myself that although she's full of shit, I'll make some prising attempts to ascertain her motives; don't get me wrong here, I do still hold attraction for her - but I'm beginning to see it as some form of attachment due to the fact that she left me. I'm not sure I'd feel the same had the roles been reversed.

Anyhow, I tell her we will commence negotiations and to state her terms;

'I don't know, play it by ear. I just want to see you really. I miss the intimacy and fantasy'.

I see where this is going. She's stretching the original terms of my offer and engaging with the idea emotionally. Nontheless she proceeds to email me all the things that she wishes to do with me, which were filthy, outrageous, and frankly I'm shocked that women actually think this way :lol: . I was toying with the idea of fucking her again; I'm more interested in seeing through the whole charade than getting my end away, but If I could do both then I would.

A week goes by and I agree to meet her in the city. We exchange messages and I make it clear, whilst not explicitly stating, that things are on my terms, and that she has to pick me up, when I want, and the time that is convenient for me. Since women respond to orders very well, she complies without any resistance.

Turns out things weren't really on my terms :roll: She sent me a message earlier, which went a little something like this; 'Y'know I don't know if I really do want to have sex. I really do want to hang out though, like buddies'.

I'm not surprised. I actually don't know whether she wants to fuck or not, but due to my improving mindset and newfound abundance of women coming into my life, I find myself unemotional and unaffected by it. It no longer surprises me the ways in which they manipulate their environment and people around them with the goal of ego validation and social dominance. Women have become a casual, objective experiment to me, and this is just a further unfolding of my research. I definitely made a few mistakes within this whole interaction but I feel the greater understanding I have gleaned surpasses them.

And with every experience I have with women, I gain a deeper understanding of their manipulative nature, and I wonder how it is that I ever thought they deserved any significant attention at all. I've also come to realise that their predicament in the Matrix is far worse than ours, atleast from where I'm seeing it right now.

I haven't replied to her yet. Maybe I won't, unless I feel like getting more out of this particular lesson. To summarise, I got played a little here but I'm happy that I got to see through the matter.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 7:04 pm 
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Leo wrote:
Nontheless she proceeds to email me all the things that she wishes to do with me, which were filthy, outrageous, ....
I love this part 8-)


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 7:07 pm 
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Yes fufe, but if you read the whole thing you will see what she is actually doing/wanting.

Thankfully I'm able to set my ego aside these days 8-)


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 7:29 pm 
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spaceman wrote:
She had a change of mind between the emails and texting that she just wants to hang out. Wonder what caused it. Hmm...
Well, what do you think?


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 7:35 pm 
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I read the whole post actually.
she's trying to see if she can "catch" you and use you - She wants to feel secure IMO from what she told you (Where does that lead ? :!: )
But most importantly, I think she reconsidered her options because of something.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 7:42 pm 
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fufe wrote:
I read the whole post actually.
she's trying to see if she can "catch" you and use you - She wants to feel secure IMO from what she told you (Where does that lead ? :!: )
But most importantly, I think she reconsidered her options because of something.
Indeed. She's in a bit of emotional turmoil, flat broke and living at a friends house with not many options. She basically feels without foundation since the promise of a life with her boyfriend evaporated , and another yr wasted for her. That means, at 24 y/o, she's going to have to find another somebody to provide for her financially and emotionally, since there is ZERO possibility of her doing this herself. She's a cool girl, but truly plugged in still. She won't find anyone near her age able and willing to provide these things, so she'll have to find an elder gent(this other guy is about 7-8 yrs older than me). Problem being she is extremely immature and has a little girl complex.

Why she has reconsidered I'm not sure;

Could be that she just doesn't want to fuck for various reasons(perhaps because I gave her what she wanted/ego validation), OR that she wants to feel safe with me first and not just be used for sex - which is pretty much the only reason I'd be interested in meeting this particular gal I guess.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 7:50 pm 
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Hm.. She probably wants to see if she can make a boyfriend out of you (making you provide all the things you listed) and if yes THEN she will let herself sleep with you.
That's my .02$


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 7:59 pm 
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C'est possible :D

'I want you to hold me and I will pretend the last year apart didn't exist'....she actually said that, in amongst telling me she wants my dick in her ass again :shock:

Essentially enticing me in again with the notion of sex.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 8:04 pm 
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....I'd be pretty much scared of her at that point :?


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 9:30 pm 
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Not disagreeing with any of your assessments or actions, just throwing some things into the mix:
Leo wrote:
Anyhow, I tell her we will commence negotiations and to state her terms;
Did you put it like this? Seems kind of businesslike to me. And would a contract be necessary if you're just going to have a bit of fun? How about:
Leo wrote:
'Can I take you up on that one night offer?'
Reply: "I don't see why not. It's not like we'd be obligated to one another or any of that complicated stuff - just havin' fun. Once i'm not doing anything else at the time." If she wanted anything else, this would leave the onus on HER to clarify if she had anything else in mind. You're in the clear. You haven't led her on in any way, since this is all I presumed you offered, an offer that SHE is referencing:
Leo wrote:
I emailed her and offered, in the name of friendship, one night only of some good lovin'.
Of course, I guess she could bring up the 'in the name of friendship' bit. Also, I figure she'd need to know that you're not gonna brag to friends about it or any of that kind of bullshit...
Leo wrote:
I'm beginning to see it as some form of attachment due to the fact that she left me.
Well spotted, by the way. Just wanted to say.....
Leo wrote:
'I don't know, play it by ear. I just want to see you really. I miss the intimacy and fantasy'.
Leo wrote:
'Y'know I don't know if I really do want to have sex. I really do want to hang out though, like buddies'.
Having said all of that, what's wrong with hanging with her for an evening that's convenient for you, where you don't have to spend that much, if anything (SHE wants to see YOU - I realise she's broke-ass, but you guys can tailor what you do to suit that). Couldn't you just go with the flow, no expectations of sex, just curious to see what she says/does IN PERSON? You can:
- observe her reactions to you and yours to her
- practice your cherry picking: let her talk and see if you can keep YOURSELF out of the convo (just gently nudging it in certain directions every now & then when you pick up that something she said has animated her slightly, to see just how EXCITED she would get when she goes off in this direction)
- observing YOUR body's reaction to her, if there's any residual feelings of ego over her leaving you, etc

etcetera

You know - a learning experience, a little practice in observation. Sex isn't the only thing you can get out of this. Remember - it's only one night, so very little investment from you.....

Speaking of sex, as far as the conversation went (although we know it's what they do, not what they say), she's the one who wants it (she asked if she could take you up on your offer), so why not let HER worry about that? If she doesn't get your amazing pimp-tight dick at the end of the night, HER loss. You've gotten an evening of fun conversation at no/little expense, with the opportunity to observe her up close & personal. Look at it like if you picked up to go to the mall or a nightclub just to observe people, but instead you're observing someone with whom you have a history, so other juicy things like her motivations, ulterior motives, her repressing of her desire (which you could get to observe & enjoy if sex isn't the first thing on your mind) can be observed. You'd be doing this face-to-face:
Leo wrote:
I'm more interested in seeing through the whole charade than getting my end away, but If I could do both then I would.
Leo wrote:
And with every experience I have with women, I gain a deeper understanding of their manipulative nature, and I wonder how it is that I ever thought they deserved any significant attention at all.
Yeah, I actually find it difficult to take the majority of them seriously anymore. There are a few rare exceptions, though....
Leo wrote:
she wants to feel safe with me first and not just be used for sex - which is pretty much the only reason I'd be interested in meeting this particular gal I guess.
Mirror? - you're using her for sex, she's using you for some form of emotional or egoic gratification? [Edit: to clarify, I think there's a distinction between using a woman for sex, and using a woman's body for your mutual enjoyment.]
Leo wrote:
'I want you to hold me and I will pretend the last year apart didn't exist'....she actually said that, in amongst telling me she wants my dick in her ass again :shock:
Although this type of 'contradiction' still eats at me very slightly - i've been doing really well at letting go of this, and the process continues - it still strikes me as pure fucking programming that this is seen as a 'contradiction'. Why can't a chick be a 'nice girl' who is soft & sweet, and also want to be totally, rawly pounded mercilessly and in 'unconventional' ways? It seems to me that I can only see these 2 images as irreconcilable if I see this type of sex as dirty or wrong.

I think this is something that every man needs to address - it's essential if we ever want to leave the safety of our mother's womb (and this is metaphoric - even a guy who had no mother or a fucked up one could have this complex, I believe) and face the real world, as Real Men.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madonna%E2 ... re_complex
Of course, this is notwithstanding the [Edit: VERY LIKELY] possibility that her sexual talk could have been an attempt to either bait you or hook you.....

_________________
"I will not grow in the light, until I pass through the darkest caverns of my heart..."

"Temet Nosce"


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 9:44 pm 
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roark wrote:
You've gotten an evening of fun conversation
:lol:

I'm not interested in an evening with her that does not result in sex. She's consistently proven herself to not be worth the effort for anything else - she only really contacts me(which she has done a few times over the last year) when she's feeling needy etc. I never contact her. I honestly would rather sit in and play GTA5 than sit and listen to her for a night. I've seen everything there is to see of her and don't need to know anything else in that regard.

The main point, however, is that she is taking my original offer and manipulating it.

It's gone from; Can I have one night to Can I have two nights to changing the days we had set to meet up to changing the original contract to telling me that the terms of the original contract don't interest her.

It may seem staunch but I can't be bothered with anything else other than abiding by what I had originally offered, because I want nothing more than that. So if THAT isn't going to happen then it doesn't concern me, but i'm not going to be flexible about it. We may be mirroring eachother, but I set the original terms and that's that. No matter who is using whom.

You have good other points, I'll have to comb through them in more detail tomorrow 8-)


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 9:48 pm 
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roark wrote:
Leo wrote:
Anyhow, I tell her we will commence negotiations and to state her terms;
Did you put it like this? Seems kind of businesslike to me. And would a contract be necessary if you're just going to have a bit of fun? How about:
It is business like but I was genuinely only role playing. In any case it was a strictly businesslike deal originally - one night, one dick, one love :lol:

She has turned into some other shit, which doesn't interest me at this time. Infact I think if I even do reply then it will be to inform her that the original terms are the only terms on offer.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 9:54 pm 
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Yeah, I was just throwing stuff out there to consider. More for my benefit than anything else really....
Leo wrote:
It's gone from; Can I have one night to Can I have two nights to changing the days we had set to meet up to changing the original contract to telling me that the terms of the original contract don't interest her.
Oh now I see. Ok.
Leo wrote:
changing the days we had set to meet up
This in itself would be enough to make me lose interest, unless she had a real good reason.

_________________
"I will not grow in the light, until I pass through the darkest caverns of my heart..."

"Temet Nosce"


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 10:00 pm 
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roark wrote:
Yeah, I was just throwing stuff out there to consider. More for my benefit than anything else really....
Leo wrote:
It's gone from; Can I have one night to Can I have two nights to changing the days we had set to meet up to changing the original contract to telling me that the terms of the original contract don't interest her.
Oh now I see. Ok.
Leo wrote:
changing the days we had set to meet up
This in itself would be enough to make me lose interest, unless she had a real good reason.
I was trying to be brief, so I'd missed certain things out but this is pertinent. Infact a few girls have been trying to rearrange things recently. I just said no to all of them and they abided. I really don't know if they are just shit testing, but atleast one of them wanted to do something else with another person. I said no, that is the time we're meeting and that settled it.

I think that with some of these bitches, they just lose respect for you if you're too flexible with your time and energy. Give them an inch and they think they're entitled to a mile. I see that all the time.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 10:11 pm 
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Leo wrote:
I think that with some of these bitches, they just lose respect for you if you're too flexible with your time and energy. Give them an inch and they think they're entitled to a mile. I see that all the time.
Logic:
- If it's a test, don't fall for it.
- If it's not a test and they're actually naturally like this (flaky & indecisive) they're not worth it, period. Why the fuck would I want to be around someone like this? This is actually a personality type that turns me off for some reason. Bail.
- If they have a good reason (emergency), it's cool. But if this happens 'too often', they're going through a really uncharacteristically bad patch in their life, and their time would be better spent not worrying about hooking up with me. Bail. :lol:

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"Temet Nosce"


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 10:28 pm 
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roark wrote:
Leo wrote:
I think that with some of these bitches, they just lose respect for you if you're too flexible with your time and energy. Give them an inch and they think they're entitled to a mile. I see that all the time.
Logic:
- If it's a test, don't fall for it.
- If it's not a test and they're actually naturally like this (flaky & indecisive) they're not worth it, period. Why the fuck would I want to be around someone like this? This is actually a personality type that turns me off for some reason. Bail.
- If they have a good reason (emergency), it's cool. But if this happens 'too often', they're going through a really uncharacteristically bad patch in their life, and their time would be better spent not worrying about hooking up with me. Bail. :lol:

I've decided to extend this experiment a little more, by being TOTALLY inflexible. I'll see how the subject responds and report back :mrgreen:


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 21, 2013 1:04 am 
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roark wrote:
Yeah, I was just throwing stuff out there to consider. More for my benefit than anything else really....
Leo wrote:
It's gone from; Can I have one night to Can I have two nights to changing the days we had set to meet up to changing the original contract to telling me that the terms of the original contract don't interest her.
Oh now I see. Ok.
Leo wrote:
changing the days we had set to meet up
This in itself would be enough to make me lose interest, unless she had a real good reason.


She´s really making sure that she is not seen as an obstacle to
rush through. (?) As in attention, and reversing it so sex can
be seen as an apology sometime along the line now (?).
The longer it takes, the more "justified", as having to explain it
to herself (?)

People try to correct their mess with the same character that
put them there. People rarely change.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 21, 2013 2:13 am 
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Leo wrote:
We met up a few months later, whereby she disclosed that her sex life was like the Antarctic wildnerness. As a joke I emailed her and offered, in the name of friendship, one night only of some good lovin'. She took it much more seriously than I presumed she would, and respectfully declined, probably with a facial expression like this :|
This joke is on you.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 21, 2013 2:27 am 
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She's broke and homeless...shit is elementary. :lol:

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EVERYTHING in life is conditional...EVERYTHING. :ugeek:


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 21, 2013 8:19 am 
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Jared wrote:
Leo wrote:
We met up a few months later, whereby she disclosed that her sex life was like the Antarctic wildnerness. As a joke I emailed her and offered, in the name of friendship, one night only of some good lovin'. She took it much more seriously than I presumed she would, and respectfully declined, probably with a facial expression like this :|
This joke is on you.
Yep. This was over a year ago though, and I was mocking her aswell.

Now she comes back. At first I was content with a lay from her, and now I'm asking what the mirror is showing me. Still, I've told her original terms or nothing at all.


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