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PostPosted: Sun Oct 30, 2022 8:36 pm 
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Stolen Focus: Why You Can't Pay Attention by Johann Hari
Quote:
“The average office worker now spends 40 percent of their work time wrongly believing they are "multitasking"--which means they are incurring all these costs for their attention and focus. In fact, uninterrupted time is becoming rare. One study found that most of us working in offices never get a whole hour uninterrupted in a normal day.”
This was a really good book! I listened to the audiobook because I like Johann's way of talking about things.

In part of the book he interviews the person that created the infinite scroll option on the web. It's where instead of having to click 'next page' on the bottom of a site, new content automatically gets loaded so we can keep scrolling.

He thought he was creating something to help surf the web more easily and it was. Later on he realized the negative effects of it.

When we have the option to keep scrolling without a break, we tend to just keep scrolling. But, before his invention, we'd get to the bottom of a page and have to decide if we wanted to go to the next page or is this something we're done with.

This all made me think of Edward de Bono's and his book on Simplicity because he talks about looking at both sides of things to get a better picture of the whole, that way we can make better decisions.

If I do this thing, what's the pros and what's the cons?

Johann also has a really good TedTalk on addiction that talks about the misconceptions of addiction.

Amazon - Stolen Focus: Why You Can't Pay Attention


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 03, 2022 3:14 pm 
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Quote:
“The average office worker now spends 40 percent of their work time wrongly believing they are "multitasking"--which means they are incurring all these costs for their attention and focus. In fact, uninterrupted time is becoming rare. One study found that most of us working in offices never get a whole hour uninterrupted in a normal day.”
This quote hit home. so much so.

I dont multi-task, I actively dont multi task and have not done for many years. It does not work for me.

Have had many discussions about this over the years with various managers and workers, mainly related to offsite working and also work from home, pre COVID. Real struggles over the years to get approval for various workers to stretch their locations and gain that period of quiet to work undistracted and focused.

Many arguments with managers who did not want to believe the numbers and more importantly wanted bums on seats in the offices, more than it seemed they wanted the work done or quality of work.

Universally, those that were requesting it returned gains in productivity and also quality of work afterwards. Equally important imho was they were happier and thought they were doing their jobs better. In my view their satisfaction levels went up.

Those same managers had all their arguments blown out of the water during covid, the numbers dont lie, productivity in some areas went through the roof, once you removed interruptions and distractions and allow the workers to do their jobs.

personally, for decades in my work life, I have actively sought out and planned those periods in, an hour uninterrupted is worth many hours of split attention work imho.

also, people underestimate in my experience, the time lost in switching between tasks, or the reduced efficiency when splitting attention between two or more things, as you rarely do both, you switch from one to the other. time-slicing them each time you do, you spend some time putting one down and picking the other up, even if just mentally and not physically.

then again maybe they are compensating and allowing for the limited attention span and trying to keep that rush going from being so busy while standing still.

From the title and the few quotes google threw up, think this is worth a read.
Thanks for bringing it up
TheDude wrote: *
This all made me think of Edward de Bono's and his book on Simplicity because he talks about looking at both sides of things to get a better picture of the whole, that way we can make better decisions.
Very much so

brings this to mind: https://www.creativebloq.com/news/3d-sl ... l-illusion

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In building a statue, a sculptor doesn't keep adding clay to his subject.He keeps chiseling away at the inessentials until the truth of its creation is revealed without obstructions. Perfection is not when there is no more to add,but no more to take away.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 06, 2022 8:11 pm 
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peregrinus wrote:
Many arguments with managers who did not want to believe the numbers and more importantly wanted bums on seats in the offices, more than it seemed they wanted the work done or quality of work.
That just makes me think of 'getting out of our own way'.

It's amazing how many times I hear about an immature manager that makes the work harder for the team. It's comedy! You're the manager, you need to manage, why are you making things harder? Idiot.

And that was the amazing thing with the whole covid experience. It forced everyone's hand. You had to see what was really happening. And even for all the people that ignore it now. They can't un-see it.

Quote:
Universally, those that were requesting it returned gains in productivity and also quality of work afterwards. Equally important imho was they were happier and thought they were doing their jobs better. In my view their satisfaction levels went up.
+3

personally, for decades in my work life, I have actively sought out and planned those periods in, an hour uninterrupted is worth many hours of split attention work imho.
So much! Over the months I've been cutting back on my own schedule and going deeper into less. Sometimes I struggle with thinking I'm not doing enough. Did you ever experience that?

All around me people are rushing around and sometimes it crosses my mind that maybe I can do more. But I notice this comes up when I'm being impatient and focusing too much on the future.

I've done some of my best work the last couple of months and a big part of that is because I'm focusing on less.

I thought I found this article on excellence from the forum, but I didn't see it on the forum so I just posted it. I think you'll like it peregrinus.

Thread - The Mundanity of Excellence


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2022 1:15 pm 
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TheDude wrote: *
It's amazing how many times I hear about an immature manager that makes the work harder for the team. It's comedy! You're the manager, you need to manage, why are you making things harder? Idiot.
Fully agree, have asked numerous managers why they are making my job harder rather than easier. At times it felt like they were working against their team.
TheDude wrote: *

So much! Over the months I've been cutting back on my own schedule and going deeper into less. Sometimes I struggle with thinking I'm not doing enough. Did you ever experience that?
yes, imho there are work environments designed to make you feel that to try and get more out of you.
I could also point back to school and education setting the foundation for this, which work then takes over later.

I think you have to see it, to let it go and then to move on and mature in your working style.

brings to mind 'work smarter not harder'
TheDude wrote: *
All around me people are rushing around and sometimes it crosses my mind that maybe I can do more. But I notice this comes up when I'm being impatient and focusing too much on the future.
past, future or present.

you could always do more, imho

the question is, how much is enough and for whom
TheDude wrote: *
I thought I found this article on excellence from the forum, but I didn't see it on the forum so I just posted it. I think you'll like it peregrinus.

Thread - The Mundanity of Excellence
Thoroughly enjoyed and agree, esp the groups.

_________________
In building a statue, a sculptor doesn't keep adding clay to his subject.He keeps chiseling away at the inessentials until the truth of its creation is revealed without obstructions. Perfection is not when there is no more to add,but no more to take away.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2022 12:21 am 
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peregrinus wrote: *
TheDude wrote: *
All around me people are rushing around and sometimes it crosses my mind that maybe I can do more. But I notice this comes up when I'm being impatient and focusing too much on the future.
past, future or present.

you could always do more, imho

the question is, how much is enough and for whom
That's a good question. Comes back to trusting myself.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 21, 2022 3:52 pm 
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stolenfocus wrote:
When adults notice that children and teens seem to be struggling to focus and pay attention today, we often say it with a weary and exasperated superiority. The implication is: Look at this degraded younger generation! Aren’t we better than them? Why can’t they be like us? But after learning all this, I think about it very differently. Children have needs—and it’s our job, as adults, to create an environment that meets those needs. In many cases, in this culture, we aren’t meeting those needs. We don’t let them play freely; we imprison them in their homes, with little to do except interact via screens; and our school system largely deadens and bores them. We feed them food that causes energy crashes, contains drug-like additives that can make them hyper, and doesn’t contain the nutrients they need. We expose them to brain-disrupting chemicals in the atmosphere. It’s not a flaw in them that causes children to struggle to pay attention. It’s a flaw in the world we built for them.


Now, when Lenore speaks to parents, she still gets them to talk about the happiest moments in their own childhoods. It’s almost always a moment when they were free—building a fort, walking through the woods with friends, playing out in the street. She says to them: “We’re scrimping and saving to send them to the dance class,” but when it comes down to it, “you’re not giving them the thing you loved the most.” We don’t have to continue like this, she tells them. There’s a different childhood waiting for our kids, if we commit, together, to rebuild it—one where they can learn, like L.B. building his boats, to focus deeply again.

_________________
In building a statue, a sculptor doesn't keep adding clay to his subject.He keeps chiseling away at the inessentials until the truth of its creation is revealed without obstructions. Perfection is not when there is no more to add,but no more to take away.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 23, 2022 4:55 pm 
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peregrinus wrote: *
stolenfocus wrote:
When adults notice that children and teens seem to be struggling to focus and pay attention today, we often say it with a weary and exasperated superiority. The implication is: Look at this degraded younger generation! Aren’t we better than them? Why can’t they be like us? But after learning all this, I think about it very differently. Children have needs—and it’s our job, as adults, to create an environment that meets those needs. In many cases, in this culture, we aren’t meeting those needs. We don’t let them play freely; we imprison them in their homes, with little to do except interact via screens; and our school system largely deadens and bores them. We feed them food that causes energy crashes, contains drug-like additives that can make them hyper, and doesn’t contain the nutrients they need. We expose them to brain-disrupting chemicals in the atmosphere. It’s not a flaw in them that causes children to struggle to pay attention. It’s a flaw in the world we built for them.


Now, when Lenore speaks to parents, she still gets them to talk about the happiest moments in their own childhoods. It’s almost always a moment when they were free—building a fort, walking through the woods with friends, playing out in the street. She says to them: “We’re scrimping and saving to send them to the dance class,” but when it comes down to it, “you’re not giving them the thing you loved the most.” We don’t have to continue like this, she tells them. There’s a different childhood waiting for our kids, if we commit, together, to rebuild it—one where they can learn, like L.B. building his boats, to focus deeply again.
Seems a lot of parents these days have trouble sticking to at least two of the "three L's" of good child rearing: love, limits, and let 'em go.
Quote:
“The rules for parent are three…love, limit and let them be.”

Elaine M. Ward

Good Morning!

Could it really be this easy? Would just these three little “rules” really work? Let’s look at each one.

Love- loving your children means loving them no matter what. It means loving them when they are screaming at you, it means loving them when they say that they hate you, it means making the hard decisions on what you believe is in their best interests. Love means walking the floors when your baby has colic, it means giving up being just “you” centered” and becoming instead “we” centered, it means being there, being available all the time, 24/7.

Limits – setting limits can be really difficult and carrying out those limits can be even harder. But children need limits. They need limits because they need to learn about life but they also need limits because without them they are really, really scared. They need someone to stand up and take charge in order for them to feel safe.

Let them be- letting them be means giving them the space and freedom to discover the world and discover who they are. It means letting them make mistakes, it means letting them fail, it means letting take responsibility for their actions without worrying about or trying to control the consequences.

I really think that Elaine M. Ward might be on to something.

So… In her words ” love, limit, and let them be”. Love them with all of your heart, enforce limits so they feel safe and then let them go out to explore the world. Sounds good to me..what do you think?
https://www.theparentguide.net/2014/09/ ... t-them-be/

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The opposite of courage in our society is not cowardice, it's conformity.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 25, 2022 10:33 am 
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https://fs.blog/great-talks/solitude-and-leadership/
Quote:
...true leadership means being able to think for yourself and act on your convictions. But how do you learn to do that? How do you learn to think? Let’s start with how you don’t learn to think. A study by a team of researchers at Stanford came out a couple of months ago. The investigators wanted to figure out how today’s college students were able to multitask so much more effectively than adults. How do they manage to do it, the researchers asked? The answer, they discovered—and this is by no means what they expected—is that they don’t. The enhanced cognitive abilities the investigators expected to find, the mental faculties that enable people to multitask effectively, were simply not there. In other words, people do not multitask effectively. And here’s the really surprising finding: the more people multitask, the worse they are, not just at other mental abilities, but at multitasking itself.

One thing that made the study different from others is that the researchers didn’t test people’s cognitive functions while they were multitasking. They separated the subject group into high multitaskers and low multitaskers and used a different set of tests to measure the kinds of cognitive abilities involved in multitasking. They found that in every case the high multitaskers scored worse. They were worse at distinguishing between relevant and irrelevant information and ignoring the latter. In other words, they were more distractible. They were worse at what you might call “mental filing”: keeping information in the right conceptual boxes and being able to retrieve it quickly. In other words, their minds were more disorganized. And they were even worse at the very thing that defines multitasking itself: switching between tasks.

Multitasking, in short, is not only not thinking, it impairs your ability to think. Thinking means concentrating on one thing long enough to develop an idea about it. Not learning other people’s ideas, or memorizing a body of information, however much those may sometimes be useful. Developing your own ideas. In short, thinking for yourself. You simply cannot do that in bursts of 20 seconds at a time, constantly interrupted by Facebook messages or Twitter tweets, or fiddling with your iPod, or watching something on YouTube.

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You may follow one stream. Know that it leads to the Ocean, but do not mistake the stream for the Ocean.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 25, 2022 7:05 pm 
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Good quote Hineini.

TheDude, many thanks for the recommendation. This was a fantastic book.

Very clear, very good explanations and a few surprises, to me at least.

Good to know we come back to known NaturalFreedom territory on its conclusion.

Recommended read / audiobook.

_________________
"The illiterate of the 21st century will not be those who cannot read and write, but those who cannot learn, unlearn, and relearn."
Alvin Toffler


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2023 9:15 pm 
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Reading this thread again was a good reminder on "less is more".

I still have a pattern of trying to do too much sometimes. And usually it gets to the point where I have to take some off my plate and I'm reminded less is more again.

Thinking about this a couple weeks ago. I think I get into this mode of trying to do more out of a feeling of fear. Fear of not accomplishing what I want. So I try to do more, but the irony is I actually start to get in my own way. Lol it's crazy!

On the topic of less is more. One thing that's helped me focusing on less is thinking about the 80/20 idea (Pareto principle). When I pick up something new I think about what's the 20% I should focus on?

Really recommend thinking about that next time you pick up something new to learn. Cuts a lot of the noise out.

peregrinus wrote: *
stolenfocus wrote:
When adults notice that children and teens seem to be struggling to focus and pay attention today, we often say it with a weary and exasperated superiority. The implication is: Look at this degraded younger generation! Aren’t we better than them? Why can’t they be like us? But after learning all this, I think about it very differently. Children have needs—and it’s our job, as adults, to create an environment that meets those needs. In many cases, in this culture, we aren’t meeting those needs. We don’t let them play freely; we imprison them in their homes, with little to do except interact via screens; and our school system largely deadens and bores them. We feed them food that causes energy crashes, contains drug-like additives that can make them hyper, and doesn’t contain the nutrients they need. We expose them to brain-disrupting chemicals in the atmosphere. It’s not a flaw in them that causes children to struggle to pay attention. It’s a flaw in the world we built for them.


Now, when Lenore speaks to parents, she still gets them to talk about the happiest moments in their own childhoods. It’s almost always a moment when they were free—building a fort, walking through the woods with friends, playing out in the street. She says to them: “We’re scrimping and saving to send them to the dance class,” but when it comes down to it, “you’re not giving them the thing you loved the most.” We don’t have to continue like this, she tells them. There’s a different childhood waiting for our kids, if we commit, together, to rebuild it—one where they can learn, like L.B. building his boats, to focus deeply again.

This reminded me of this quote from Anthony de Mello:
Quote:
Maturity is when you no longer blame anyone. You don’t blame others; you don’t blame yourself. You see what’s wrong, and you set about remedying it.


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