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PostPosted: Sat Jul 19, 2014 6:52 pm 
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How big of a role to do you think IQ plays in success?

I have a few different thoughts, from reading and am not sure of the best way to connect them.

For example: Scores on IQ tests are largely broken into two main categories Fluid Intelligence and Crystallized Intelligence. Fluid Intelligence is thought to be largely innate and intricately connected with working memory. Whereas Crystallized Intelligence is a product of what we have learned.

The part about working memory feels correct from personal experience. I have noticed that my working memory tends to get overwhelmed in high range IQ tests. It's not that I cannot see the patterns it's that it's too many pieces of information to hold in at one time.

The other part is how people of varying IQ levels, deal with information.

For Example: People with an IQ in the 100 range or so...not interested in information at all really.
People with an IQ in the high range 115-120+ like to take in information and sort it.
People with an IQ in the genius range 140+ like to sort information and then create
entirely new systems from it.

This also makes sense because I can contrast it, my IQ is 128. For as long as I can remember I have always like to take information in and sort it. I haven't created anything really though. Patterns are easy to see and connections can be made in unique ways from the information I get.

Yours, if I remember correctly is "150(verified)". Obviously, you have created systems. Were you always like that? Or were you more inclined to take in information and then in your later 20's once the information had reached critical mass begin to create?

So, that part makes sense as well.

I have have plans for everything, and will end up successful not worried about that. I still just feel like I haven't really struck on my calling really is and want to actually create something. No idea what though.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 9:10 pm 
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Quote:
How big of a role to do you think IQ plays in success?


It's kind of hard to quantify. In general, success is less about intelligence and more about being in the right place at the right time...and knowing the right person. :geek:

Were you always like that? Or were you more inclined to take in information and then in your later 20's once the information had reached critical mass begin to create?

I guess I've always tried to experiment and implement systems within systems. Always experimenting. I tend to implement on the fly as I'm collecting and processing data, and then make adjustments in real time as I take in the feedback. :geek:

Oh, and the last IQ test I took put me at like 135. I guess I lot a few points since I was a kid when I tested at 150 in elementary school. :oops: :lol:

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 10:41 pm 
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How do you define IQ?

Who defines the tests?

Is IQ different for different tasks/professions? Some require different mental tasks and knowledge (beyond teaching etc)

How close would your results be if you took a number of tests in different countries?

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 11:04 pm 
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peregrinus wrote:

How close would your results be if you took a number of tests in different countries?


An interesting health article:

Bilingual Brains Age More Slowly

http://www.scienceworldreport.com/artic ... lthood.htm

Quote:
Findings showed that those who spoke more than one language tested better on intelligence tests, regardless of when the second language was picked up.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 11:57 pm 
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Jared wrote:
Findings showed that those who spoke more than one language tested better on intelligence tests, regardless of when the second language was picked up.




Oohh time to become a ploygot

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 11:49 am 
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Last time I did and IQ test I socred 107 or 105.. Lol


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 4:43 pm 
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Hmm, it just makes me interested how some people are so efficient at learning. My physics teacher said that he used to go to school with a guy that never even looked in his textbooks or went to class and was getting 90s. I also worked with someone who used to only answer 50% of the questions on his math tests to piss the teacher off.

I don't understand the difference in cognitive function between me and someone like that. How are they light years ahead of me?

I would regard IQ tests that test exclusively fluid intelligence. Instead of what specific words I happen to have in my vocabulary etc.

You also have to be careful fufe. Some tests inflate your score, and some that are serious normalize teir database through all of the people that have taken the test so someone that takes one of those would probably be higher than the score they get.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 10:15 pm 
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Altair wrote:
I still just feel like I haven't really struck on my calling really is and want to actually create something. No idea what though.


I'm surprised nobody respondedn to this.. :?:


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 11:52 pm 
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fufe wrote:
Altair wrote:
I still just feel like I haven't really struck on my calling really is and want to actually create something. No idea what though.


I'm surprised nobody respondedn to this.. :?:


That's because this is a question that no one can answer.

The main thing that drives me is to learn about everything, the only unsolved factor in the equation is time. I thought about this a lot in the last couple days. My path will become clear, in time :ugeek: . In the meanwhile, the only thing I can do is push myself to be even further ahead of the curve.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 2:27 am 
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IQ is all about attitude and some other things I forgot about that I told you.

It seems like you did the heavy lifting and confirmed things like the database issue that I speculated about earlier.

Remember the point of what I was telling you. Dedication is what matters more than intelligence. The world has a way of helping those whose values align with their actions. If your value system is not congruent with your actions then you will have problems.

For example, I liked class and loved what I was learning and had an exceptional IQ in 5th grade or something of 124 - 130. My values have changed, and I think most information is not useful. My IQ has lowered to 105 (there are also problems with databases). A psychiatrist told me that IQ does not decline but specializes. In fact, he even said that I'm most likely a clinical genius, the only compliment he ever gave me. You max out at the point that your grey matter and white matter stop growing. Your brain grows until late adolescence.

The point at which your ego starts maturing is when your IQ specializes because you have special interests. If I kept pace with my growth and did not specialize then my IQ would match my age. After 18 IQ is worthless because you don't learn generally. You go to college and specialize in your learning. However, IQ tests expand the range of what they weight when you age because their meant to measure a range of information.

My IQ stayed in the range I mentioned up to the age of 18. It's only been 5 years and it has declined. Aside from catastrophic brain damage, it does not make sense that my IQ would decline rapidly. So, there has to be another reason at play, which is the testing and specialization. My weakest point is visualization. Consequently, I struggle with building things. I haven't flexed my artistic skills in over 6 years and haven't flexed the extent of my math skills in four.

I would even speculate that IQ does not change after 5th grade in the US or age 11. My reason stems from watching the development of my brother.

IQ tests are known to cater to Europeans/whites. Most black people score extremely low on IQ tests if they haven't had exceptional formal education. This is in the United States only.

The history of IQ tests is that they were used as a form of supremacy to encourage the use of eugenics to stop minorities from reproducing. Think about that.

If the test was originally meant to qualify certain people to be sterilized then is it actually possible to accurately measure the development of intelligence over time in that framework?

If IQ tests have been revamped since the 1920's-1960's then what is the new framework? There isn't one because the game doesn't change the players change. Developmental psychology didn't take off until the 1990's. If IQ tests were revamped in the 1990's and again in our current era then what makes them effective at measuring intelligence if it's based on developmental psychology? Basic information that everyone learns before the ego fully matures and people start specializing.

If the human mind is easily measured then why would psychologists keep redeveloping IQ tests? It relates to the accumulation of human knowledge. Great authors and mathematicians such as Aristotle, John Locke (logician), and leibniz (logician and mathematician) have been speculated to have IQ's from 160 - 200. There is no way to measure those people.

Look up the top 10 people with the highest IQ's in the world and think about the top 5 people carefully. All of them were most likely accelerated in general learning and were forced to dedicate themselves to learning. All of what makes them special happened happened in the early years of their childhood. See the earlier part of this harangue about children. Their general learning never ended and was impressed on them.

Cliff notes: dedication, racism, and general learning.

Edit: for your personal endeavors, Altair, creating systems is not hard. I built a submarine from scratch in the 7th grade in science. I would have even made the motor, but my mom wouldn't let me search for the parts I wanted.

Just recently with an IQ of 105 I fixed a motorized pump to a spraying system by just studying it for a few hours and taking out the parts.

Food for thought.

More food for thought and the big picture you're searching for.

"Necessity is the mother of invention" -- Author unknown

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Necessity_is_the_mother_of_invention

For example, Meraki thought up the and coined a more advanced way of theoretically talking about seeds and accelerants.

He did not invent that. He merely had the need for a tool to accomplish a larger goal with a woman. This is not to say that he needed a woman though.

The Kidd thought up and coined a more advanced way of using pimp principles, which was spurred by the wheel that Iceberg Slim wrote about. What is important is that The Kidd adapted the system to suit his necessities. Aside from knowing a history about both individuals I can't make anymore speculations.

Again, this is not to say that The Kidd needed women, but he needed a tool to apply his thoughts through as a focused lens.

This is how the history of knowledge works. Intelligence is merely a byproduct of condensed knowledge. IQ tests are merely a tool to measure a tool.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 3:21 am 
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"All of us are better than one of us."

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 10:39 am 
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I would think that measuring IQ #s is more of an ego thing than it is about observing, categorizing, responding and all that. Some people can be very intelligent in their fields and have an utter lack of social understanding.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 6:57 pm 
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moose35 wrote:
I would think that measuring IQ #s is more of an ego thing than it is about observing, categorizing, responding and all that. Some people can be very intelligent in their fields and have an utter lack of social understanding.


Hence, all the forms of Intelligence Jared wrote about.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 8:52 pm 
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I still think pattern recognition is a huge determining factor, and it can be effectively measured.

If you go to the gym and try to increase the weight that you lift does that make you egotistical?

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 9:10 pm 
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Altair wrote:
I still think pattern recognition is a huge determining factor, and it can be effectively measured.

If you go to the gym and try to increase the weight that you lift does that make you egotistical?


I know this is directed to moose. But,
It does makes you more egotistic, and I don't see nothing wrong with that.

Also if you want to be more intelligent that the "normalcy" it's an ego reason, the reason is to "BE BETTER THAN." Competition and having advantage above others, is ingrained in our primitive biological machines, no matter how much you try to pharaprase it to seem different. Better accepting it, or much more better in my opinion, asking ourselves: Why do I want this? Why do I want to have better IQ than any other regular Joe?

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 8:50 am 
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Altair wrote:
I still think pattern recognition is a huge determining factor, and it can be effectively measured.



Did you say patterns?  :P

http://www.commonchinesecharacters.com/ ... Characters

http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E6%BC%A2%E5%AD%97

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_j% ... 5%8D_kanji

Learning them will give an Asian student the advantage of ... decent literacy

A kanji joke: 8-)

 = woman
 =noisy; quarrelsome
 =wicked

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 10:49 am 
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Altair wrote:
I still think pattern recognition is a huge determining factor, and it can be effectively measured.

If you go to the gym and try to increase the weight that you lift does that make you egotistical?


No. But wondering if your unique genetic make-up is why you're putting on weight might.

I wasn't judging you or whatever, just seems to be a common trend among people who are curious about their IQ. Why else would it matter?

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 4:45 pm 
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Not an unfair assertion.

Ego is an effect tool so I use it, to my advantage. Besides skill in anything is relative anyways.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 6:30 pm 
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Altair wrote:
Not an unfair assertion.

Ego is an effect tool so I use it, to my advantage. Besides skill in anything is relative anyways.


Now, viewing the Ego as a tool is an effective strategy for mental peace. Means you can manipulate it. (if you know how to do that though) I think here, under this context I present, Ego and Mind are synonymous.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 6:53 pm 
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THE MYTH OF IQ
Quote:
It took 110,000 volunteers and a $5M brain scanner to do it, but finally, the notion that intelligence or 'IQ" is a single, measurable human trait that can literally 'divide nations', has been laid to rest.

The bottom line is: cognitively, what makes one person different from another - what we often call intelligence - is too complex to boil down to a single factor or ‘IQ’.

http://www.discoveryuk.com/the-loop/the-myth-of-iq/

Scientists debunk the IQ myth: Notion of measuring one's intelligence quotient by singular, standardized test is highly misleading
Quote:
The results showed that when a wide range of cognitive abilities are explored, the observed variations in performance can only be explained with at least three distinct components: short-term memory, reasoning and a verbal component.

"Regular brain training didn't help people's cognitive performance at all yet aging had a profound negative effect on both memory and reasoning abilities," says Owen.

Hampshire adds, "Intriguingly, people who regularly played computer games did perform significantly better in terms of both reasoning and short-term memory. And smokers performed poorly on the short-term memory and the verbal factors, while people who frequently suffer from anxiety performed badly on the short-term memory factor in particular."

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20 ... 133334.htm

IQ tests are 'meaningless and too simplistic' claim researchers
Quote:
- Researchers say findings are a 'wake up call' for anyone using current tests

- Comes after biggest ever study of intelligence

'We need to stop trying to simplify the brain, which is very complicated organ, down to a number.

‘We need to think of intelligence like the Olympics. Is the gold medal winner in the marathon fitter than the gold medallist in the 100m sprint?’

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/ ... chers.html

It takes more than an IQ to describe how our brains work
Quote:
Intelligence Quotient, or IQ, has been used to sort people, whether job candidates or schoolchildren, for decades. Now, a century after psychologists first came up with the idea of “general intelligence”, the world’s biggest study of its kind has put paid to the simplistic idea that we can use an IQ figure to describe the astonishing abilities of the human brain.

Anecdotally, we all know people who are fantastic at speaking French, but poor at puzzles, or who can reel off telephone numbers from the top of their heads but are hopeless at maths. We also know that it would be absurd to use an “athletics quotient” to compare a long-distance runner with a sprinter. But in science you need hard evidence, and that is what we have managed to produce, with the help of 100,000-plus people – including many Daily Telegraph readers – who took part in the largest online intelligence test of its kind.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/9758 ... -work.html

IQ tests are 'fundamentally flawed' and using them alone to measure intelligence is a 'fallacy', study finds
Quote:
Results cast into doubt tests that have been used to link cognitive ability to race, gender and class

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/scien ... 25911.html

IQ ‘a myth,’ study says
Quote:
“There is no such thing as a single measure of IQ or a measure of general intelligence," says Dr. Adrian Owen, the study’s senior investigator and the Canada Excellence Research Chair in Cognitive Neuroscience and Imaging at the university’s Brain and Mind Institute.

http://www.thestar.com/life/2012/12/19/ ... says.html#

IQ tests 'do not reflect intelligence'
Quote:
IQ tests are misleading because they do not accurately reflect intelligence, according to a study which found that a minimum of three different exams are needed to measure someone's brainpower.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/scie ... gence.html

Western University research team turning the idea of intelligence testing on its head
http://www.lfpress.com/2012/12/19/iq-te ... chers-find

Roger Highfield: 'Raise your IQ instantly -- by no longer believing in it'
http://www.wired.co.uk/magazine/archive ... -instantly

Another myth debunked. Pff, that matrix and its myths. It gets tiresome.

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