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indifference or no indifference?
http://naturalfreedom.info/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=466		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Sniper [ Mon Sep 06, 2010 9:16 pm ]
Post subject:  indifference or no indifference?
hey guys,

I was reading a philosiphy book today and then it made me think a lot about stuff. Then I started to think about indifference in regards to the seduction community.....

Now it seems like some teachers of the seduction community are riding on the indifference concept which is a bit 'new age'.

I have not read Jake's ebook just yet but I did listen to Brent talk about it, Zan also talked about it a little bit and Marcus mentioned it on the realm forum.

Since Marcus's advise was that if I'll do 'natural grounding' I'll become indifferent and I'll stop wanting women- I'm going to skip it. I know some people on realm worship the guy but for me that kind of advise is wholly not practical.

Now Brent also talks about it and gives some more practical advise on how to achieve it:
like creating your life story, affirmations, visualization and more.

Zan also talks about it in the sense of having an adventure and a higher purpose in life and then you won't care that much about having success with women.

Ok Now here is what I think:
I have talked to Libertas about this and we both agreed that once someone has already slept with a lot of women (that includes: Brent, Zan, Mystery (the number 1 PUA), and Marcus also had a great sex life), then it's very easy to be indifferent and say I don't care if I get laid or not.

Also, if someone has done a lot of meditation And was able to get rid of attachments: then maybe he can be indifferent.

But taking a regular guy who never had success or still a virgin And tell him:
'you know what: it's not a big deal, forget about having success with women'....
I don't think that's going to work for most guys....


Now I'm not saying one needs to sleep with a lot of women to realize that sex (althugh very nice) is not going to make you a happy man. I also know that real happiness does not come from women but from the inside.

I will admit I have reached some level of indifference already, but one thing I have noticed is this:

after I broke up with my girlfriend I was more indifferent than before (and I'm not totaly indifferent just yet ;) )

So I think that real\total indifference can come only after you have had some success.

just some food for the thought....

p.s
I know it's ego but we all still have one :lol:
Author:  peregrinus [ Mon Sep 06, 2010 10:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: indifference or no indifference?
Sniper wrote:
I have talked to Libertas about this and we both agreed that once someone has already slept with a lot of women (that includes: Brent, Zan, Mystery (the number 1 PUA), and Marcus also had a great sex life), then it's very easy to be indifferent and say I don't care if I get laid or not.
This I agree with. If you have had a lot of success and have reached a level where you either know you can achieve it any-time or are turning women away, it is very easy to be indifferent. If you look at other areas of life this pattern also shows there.

However, I have also known men who have slept with a lot of women (over 130 women in one case I am thinking of) who have not reached indifference.. It does depend on how you take that internally.
I think more it is about if you realise that it is more about quality than quantity. Then your attitude does change.

Also, most of those men, I suspect if you put the right woman in front of them who satisfied all of their criteria, they would be FAR from indifferent.
Sniper wrote:
Also, if someone has done a lot of meditation And was able to get rid of attachments: then maybe he can be indifferent.
This is very possible, when I got deep into this it really did change my level of attachment to outcome, which changed my level of indifference.
I have also seen this effect in friends of mine locally who I introduced meditation to. Meditation on themselves, not women, seeking peace and self realisation.

This is tied to YOU being the source of your happiness, not a woman you may meet.
Sniper wrote:
But taking a regular guy who never had success or still a virgin And tell him:
'you know what: it's not a big deal, forget about having success with women'....
I don't think that's going to work for most guys....
I would tell him "no matter how hot you think she is, somewhere there is someone who is fed up with her and does not want to fuck her" <- reality check... It is true in all the cases I have come across.

AS above, YOU should be the source of your happiness, not someone else.
Sniper wrote:
I will admit I have reached some level of indifference already, but one thing I have noticed is this:
after I broke up with my girlfriend I was more indifferent than before (and I'm not totaly indifferent just yet ;) )
So I think that real\total indifference can come only after you have had some success.
Real total indifference is NOTHING to do with success!
Real total indifference is purely about your mindset and internal state.
Sniper wrote:
Now I'm not saying one needs to sleep with a lot of women to realize that sex (althugh very nice) is not going to make you a happy man. I also know that real happiness does not come from women but from the inside.
See above comment. The two are interlinked.

A lot of pointless connectionless sex is NOT going to make me a happy man.. I know that for sure, from experience. In fact it makes me unhappy, as it is empty.

IT IS NOT ABOUT THEM - IT IS ABOUT YOU.
Once you realise that, then your attitude will change.

-

Realise that you have a FAR greater gift to offer them than they have to offer you (NOT IN AN EGO WAY, pure truth)
Author:  Sniper [ Mon Sep 06, 2010 10:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: indifference or no indifference?
peregrinus wrote:
Realise that you have a FAR greater gift to offer them than they have to offer you (NOT IN AN EGO WAY, pure truth)
great post man, allow me to Put a little ego and Comedy in here, just for fun :D ;)
I always laugh so hard when I hear David X say: 'What are we chasing? we are chasing that fucking....that's all your chasing. Those good looking girls, sometimes they......fish'.
I always laugh so hard when I hear him say that :lol:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AfCSEb1vlP8
from 07:33 until 08:00

Now let's get serious again :geek: , when you wrote this:
Quote:
Also, most of those men, I suspect if you put the right woman in front of them who satisfied all of their criteria, they would be FAR from indifferent.
Did you mean that if I put a woman in front of Brent (for example) that satisfied all of his criteria, He would not be so indifferent?
Author:  Azriel [ Tue Sep 07, 2010 3:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: indifference or no indifference?
I did this long winded things where I changed all my paradigms about women and about myself in the context of Nathaniel Branden's idea of self esteem.

It worked.

The reason detatchment didn't work on me was because of an illness thing, I used EFT on it and I care more about having fun with them rather than putting anything in them. Besides, what are the odds of them knowing how to give a decent blowjob?
Yes, NG doesn't take away your wanting to put your wang in something... Preferably something sentient and with a pulse...... And female.

"But Aztec, what if I'm gay?"
Then you're an abomination unto god and have a disease.
"Really?
No.
Author:  peregrinus [ Tue Sep 07, 2010 9:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: indifference or no indifference?
Sniper wrote:
Did you mean that if I put a woman in front of Brent (for example) that satisfied all of his criteria, He would not be so indifferent?
YES!
Tell me I am wrong? :)

On another note.. I was looking for a quote I remembered, could not find it but came across these ones:
Carl Jung wrote:
Into this territory a man must venture if he wishes to meet woman half way. Circumstances have forced her to aquire a number of masculine traits, so that she shall not remain caught in an antiquated, purely instinctual femininity, lost and alone in the world of men. So, too, man will be forced to develop his feminine side, to open his eyes to the psyche and to Eros. It is a task he cannot avoid, unless he prefers to go trailing after woman in a hopelessly boyish fashion, worshipping from afar but always in danger of being stowed away in her pocket.
Friedrich Nietzsche wrote:
“Behind all their personal vanity, women themselves always have an impersonal contempt for woman.”
Alexandre Dumas wrote:
It is only rarely that one can see in a little boy the promise of a man, but one can almost always see in a little girl the threat of a woman.
For some reason I cannot seem to find the quote I remembered.
The message of it was along the lines of : Women always fail to live up to my boyish fantasies of what they would be like.

It was one that struck me when I read it as being from someone who had reached a level of indifference. Rather than looking at all women as being perfect and idolising them, he was seeing them for what they are and able to see them flaws and all. He also accepted that his fantasy ideal woman was just that - a fantasy.
Author:  GoldenBoy [ Thu Aug 09, 2012 6:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: indifference or no indifference?
This thread belongs to the treasure chest, if not, only for the Grinus's posts
Author:  Altair [ Thu Aug 09, 2012 8:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: indifference or no indifference?
I had an insight like Grinus' when I reached indifference with women.

I realized indifference would give me everything I wanted. But not in things I gained...the real value is in the things you lose. :)

Just like his signature.
Author:  StephenP [ Wed Aug 15, 2012 4:36 am ]
Post subject:  Re: indifference or no indifference?
Quote:
But not in things I gained...the real value is in the things you lose.
Interesting 8-)
Author:  zogler [ Tue May 18, 2021 5:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: indifference or no indifference?
"The capacity to be alone is the capacity to love. It may look paradoxical to you, but it's not. It is an existential truth: only those people who are capable of being alone are capable of love, of sharing, of going into the deepest core of another person--without possessing the other, without becoming dependent on the other, without reducing the other to a thing, and without becoming addicted to the other. They allow the other absolute freedom, because they know that if the other leaves, they will be as happy as they are now. Their happiness cannot be taken by the other, because it is not given by the other."
— Osho
Author:  The Kidd!! [ Tue May 18, 2021 8:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: indifference or no indifference?
Indifference makes the difference 😎
Author:  peregrinus [ Fri May 21, 2021 11:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: indifference or no indifference?
From: viewtopic.php?p=48620#p48620
Hineini wrote: *Fri May 21, 2021 4:16 pm
Quote:
Of all the loaded words in Stoic philosophy, “indifferent” is one of the most provocative. Marcus Aurelius, Seneca, and Epictetus each tell us that the Stoic is indifferent to external things, indifferent to wealth, indifferent to pain, indifferent to winning, indifferent to hope and dreams and everything else. You hear it enough times and it starts to sound like these people don’t care about anything. Especially since the modern definition of the word means precisely that. But this is a dangerous misreading.

The Stoics were not indifferent in that sense at all, it’s that they were good either way. It’s not that they didn’t care, it’s that they were good either way. Does that make sense? The point was to be strong enough that there wasn’t a need to need things to go in a particular direction. Seneca for his part would say that obviously it’s better to be rich than poor, tall than short, but the Stoic was indifferent when fate actually dealt out its hand on the matter. Because the Stoic was strong enough to make good of it—whatever it was.
Author:  peregrinus [ Wed May 26, 2021 3:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: indifference or no indifference?
To follow, from virtues https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virtue

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Upek%E1%B9%A3%C4%81

Quote:
To practice upekkha is to be unwavering or to stay neutral in the face of the eight vicissitudes of life—which are otherwise known as the eight worldly winds or eight worldly conditions: loss and gain, good-repute and ill-repute, praise and censure, and sorrow and happiness (the Attha Loka Dhamma).

The "far enemy" of Upekkha is greed and resentment, mind-states in obvious opposition. The "near enemy" (the quality which superficially resembles upekkha but which subtly opposes it), is indifference or apathy.
Quote:
American Buddhist monk Bhikkhu Bodhi wrote:

"The real meaning of upekkha is equanimity, not indifference in the sense of unconcern for others. As a spiritual virtue, upekkha means stability in the face of the fluctuations of worldly fortune. It is evenness of mind, unshakeable freedom of mind, a state of inner equipoise that cannot be upset by gain and loss, honor and dishonor, praise and blame, pleasure and pain. Upekkha is freedom from all points of self-reference; it is indifference only to the demands of the ego-self with its craving for pleasure and position, not to the well-being of one's fellow human beings. True equanimity is the pinnacle of the four social attitudes that the Buddhist texts call the 'divine abodes': boundless loving-kindness, compassion, altruistic joy, and equanimity. The last does not override and negate the preceding three, but perfects and consummates them."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equanimity
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