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PostPosted: Sat Mar 29, 2014 9:05 am 
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Very interesting night.

I will fast forward to the most interesting part. 8-)

It is unclear to me at this point if how deep his knowledge ran, but it is by the closest I have ever come to meeting someone like us.

So I am standing at the corner of the bar, my friend is talking to this girl who has crush on him and her friend. This guy is standing on the very corner with his hand there holding his place. He is wearing a red shirt, I auto profile him as a potential source of a problem. There is something off about him but I cannot find words for it, so I resign myself to keeping an eye on him.

He walks off, so I write him off as a hater, he obviously noticed me but seemed more focused on the interaction between my friend and those girls. So I assume that he has folded his hand, validated by the fact that when I truly cloak I have never been detected. :geek:

I get another drink and a few minutes he comes back, and stands there kinda close to my space. Weird there are no girls there now...not making sense in the context.

So I say

Altair: What's up?
Him: What do you mean what's up?
Me: Exactly, what I said.
At this point there is unwavering eye contact and the attempt of physical intimidation.
A bit back and forth....
Him: What is your goal in this interaction? :evil:
At this point it is clear to me that he can see through my cloak and is obviously more than the average opponent. I uncloak but remain cloaked to everyone around me including my friends. Who are oblivious to all of this.
Me: What is the goal of any interaction? (what I consider a smokescreen) and then I counter with "What are your goals for this interaction? (before he has a chance to respond to the first question)
He doesn't have a ready made counter.
The interaction just held in this limbo of intimidation and I turn slightly to protect my vitals waiting for him to go for the first hit. Never taking eyes off each other.
His friend comes up, and goes to say something and he just holds up one finger to his mouth like don't talk. He friend complies so this is obviously a person accustomed to power.
We hold eye contact a bit more, then he extends his hand and says "....a worthy opponent". We shake hands with mutual respect and go our seperate ways.
....in all of the countless interactions I have seen and thought about. I have never once seen someone like that...very impressive 8-)

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 29, 2014 9:24 am 
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Interesting,

...at the same time, are you telling us that
you have not had any 1 on 1 mentors, (live) ?

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 29, 2014 2:01 pm 
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:lol:
Out here in Romania we have a saying: "If u go out looking for trouble, u will find it". I see this every time I go out. Seems to me like the guy was looking for some trouble, but guys that do that they search for whom they percieve to be weaker, or who they believe they can take out. U were a "worthy opponent", so he didn't want to start shit.

I personally get tested like that almost everyday b/c I live in a periphery of my city. Under the disguize of "anti-discrimination" and "european city", and of course getting votes and some other political-corrupt-selling land at a higher price bullshit, the mayor built in my neighborhood small homes for the less fortunate and half of the inhabitants are gypsies. Gypsies don't give a fuck about the society, they live by they own rules. They are very animalistic, and they raised to fight and steal from childhood. Now, the bus that connects me to the city, has a station right in front of my block. And the next and last station is where this "gipsy land" is, so there are always gypsies in the bus, now. But they always travel in numbers. So of course some of them are trying to start shit verbally, but indirectly... putting loud music on the phone, swearing, yelling, talking loud etc, which I learned to ignore and focus my attention on something else. And if u stand up to them, there is always a posibility to get into a fight. That is how they prove their manhood and that is all they know, really. I stood up to 2 of them gypsies once, I had to watch my back from that point until they got off the bus. I wear glasses so I had to watch myself to not get sneakely punched in the face as they get off. I had to keep an eye on them for a long time and be ready to get into a fight, if necesarry. Kind of stressful job. Literally the next week after this, an older man once stood up to them, and once he got off the bus, there were 3 of them, they followed him and bust his eye with a rock. The older man lost his eye and now he is blind. Those fuckers are in jail, now. ( Not to mention when you hear shit like: "I'm not afraid of going to jail" ).
But it's never phisical, thank god! If it gets to phisical, then there is a BIG problem and I will not tolerate that by any circumstance. No one is allowed to put his hands on me. Period !

Now, Altair. After the encounter, did u payed attention what he did after that ? Where did he positioned himself ? Or did u moved on ?


Last edited by DMD on Sat Mar 29, 2014 2:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 29, 2014 2:06 pm 
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I have to ask man - what exactly were you 2 "battling" over? Don't want to project my interpretation onto it.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 29, 2014 2:10 pm 
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moose35 wrote:
I have to ask man - what exactly were you 2 "battling" over? Don't want to project my interpretation onto it.

Dominance and respect.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 29, 2014 6:01 pm 
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Jared wrote:
Interesting,

...at the same time, are you telling us that
you have not had any 1 on 1 mentors, (live) ?
I have not.
DMD wrote:
Now, Altair. After the encounter, did u payed attention what he did after that ? Where did he positioned himself ? Or did u moved on ?
After we shook hands, he went off to mingle with his friends on the dance floor. I wasn't worried about it at that point, if something was gonna happen he would have done it then.
moose35 wrote:
I have to ask man - what exactly were you 2 "battling" over? Don't want to project my interpretation onto it.
My position on the bar was such that retreat wasn't an option. It wasn't intimidation in the sense that he was trying to physically intimidate me. I mean it was but it was more about who was more comfortable with the psychological space than actually exchanging blows.

Most people when they try to be intimidating are very primitive and caveman like about it, they're easy to slip around and out manoever. It's interesting to see someone understand psychological space and aggressively use it to try to make people uncomfortable like that.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 11:07 am 
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Cool.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 11:55 am 
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Altair wrote:
Jared wrote:
Interesting,

...at the same time, are you telling us that
you have not had any 1 on 1 mentors, (live) ?
I have not.
DMD wrote:
Now, Altair. After the encounter, did u payed attention what he did after that ? Where did he positioned himself ? Or did u moved on ?
After we shook hands, he went off to mingle with his friends on the dance floor. I wasn't worried about it at that point, if something was gonna happen he would have done it then.
moose35 wrote:
I have to ask man - what exactly were you 2 "battling" over? Don't want to project my interpretation onto it.
My position on the bar was such that retreat wasn't an option. It wasn't intimidation in the sense that he was trying to physically intimidate me. I mean it was but it was more about who was more comfortable with the psychological space than actually exchanging blows.

Most people when they try to be intimidating are very primitive and caveman like about it, they're easy to slip around and out manoever. It's interesting to see someone understand psychological space and aggressively use it to try to make people uncomfortable like that.
I remember some dude in the gym tried that caveman shit on me "hater jobz", I just went silent and I felt my prescence and emotions in my body like fully and never retreated, the steroid guys that where friends of him felt my power and the fucker indirectly got really nervous, he stuttered some random word. I didn't even won, I just acknowlege his taunt and just went fully present in his attempt to down grade me, seems like he didn't knew this kind of power. Wordz count from my part was: 0. Bitch just got burned.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2014 12:50 pm 
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1-percenters hang out at exclusive places (clubs, restaurants, resorts, hotels, golf clubs, sex clubs etc.) where we may only enter as servants. I doubt that he is a member of the elite.

I consider long-standing members of Natural Freedom to be confident, mature men who admire like-minded men when they see them and think of them as friends or allies, not opponents. His behavior oozed insecurity and immaturity, especially the need to test you. Only someone trapped in the "alpha male" bullshit would feel threatened by you, unless he was bored and used you as a challenge - maybe this was the case for you too.

And I don't see why you have to cloak if you are comfortable in your own skin and respectful, as if you were arrogant and provocative. On the contrary, we should inspire other men by being a shining example. Our eyes and body language should convey our masculinity. We need instigators.

When he approached you, you could have given him the space to express himself without initiating verbal communication. If there is nothing irreverent, let him play his game. You are not required to take part.

Your story reminded me of the following:
Quote:
The shoulders communicate vitality but they can also communicate dominance and hierarchy. Over my career I have interviewed a lot of criminals and I always made it a point to ask how they assessed their victims before they acted out. Over and over three things stood out, how their victims looked (frail, weak, not athletic), their overall situational awareness (never go after someone who sees you first), and their arm swing (vigorous arm movement or passive subdued). And so to a criminal, our own intra-species predators, as Robert Hare would call them, how the shoulders look is a key factor for those who seek to prey on us. As one psychopath said to me, and this was very telling, “silverbacks don’t go after silverbacks, they go after everything else.” Good point.
http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/spy ... y-about-us

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2014 1:18 pm 
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I AGREE WITH EVERYTHING ZOGLER SAID !!!! Especially THIS:
zogler wrote:
I consider long-standing members of Natural Freedom to be confident, mature men who admire like-minded men when they see them and think of them as friends or allies, not opponents. His behavior oozed insecurity and immaturity, especially the need to test you. Only someone trapped in the "alpha male" bullshit would feel threatened by you, unless he was bored and used you as a challenge - maybe this was the case for you too.
THis was kind of my thought process, but I couldn't express it the way Mr. Zogler did. What a shame :lol: . It didn't sound like a guy that's great with women to me, either. That's why I asked u what did he do afterwards as I was expecting an answer like: "he went and talk to this girl, that girl", not b/c he had to necesarily, but going out and putting oneself in a position where one can end up in a fight with other men, that's just childish and ridicules, and a complete waste of time that achieves NOTHING. I'm talking about the dude. I never met a guy that's great with women and focuses his attention on men when there are women around.
DMD wrote:
Seems to me like the guy was looking for some trouble, but guys that do that they search for whom they percieve to be weaker, or who they believe they can take out. U were a "worthy opponent", so he didn't want to start shit.
Quote:
The shoulders communicate vitality but they can also communicate dominance and hierarchy. Over my career I have interviewed a lot of criminals and I always made it a point to ask how they assessed their victims before they acted out. Over and over three things stood out, how their victims looked (frail, weak, not athletic), their overall situational awareness (never go after someone who sees you first), and their arm swing (vigorous arm movement or passive subdued)..... and this was very telling, “silverbacks don’t go after silverbacks, they go after everything else.” Good point.
:lol: :lol: :lol:


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2014 5:48 pm 
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zogler wrote:
1-percenters hang out at exclusive places (clubs, restaurants, resorts, hotels, golf clubs, sex clubs etc.) where we may only enter as servants. I doubt that he is a member of the elite.

I consider long-standing members of Natural Freedom to be confident, mature men who admire like-minded men when they see them and think of them as friends or allies, not opponents. His behavior oozed insecurity and immaturity, especially the need to test you. Only someone trapped in the "alpha male" bullshit would feel threatened by you, unless he was bored and used you as a challenge - maybe this was the case for you too.

And I don't see why you have to cloak if you are comfortable in your own skin and respectful, as if you were arrogant and provocative. On the contrary, we should inspire other men by being a shining example. Our eyes and body language should convey our masculinity. We need instigators.

When he approached you, you could have given him the space to express himself without initiating verbal communication. If there is nothing irreverent, let him play his game. You are not required to take part.

Your story reminded me of the following:
Quote:
The shoulders communicate vitality but they can also communicate dominance and hierarchy. Over my career I have interviewed a lot of criminals and I always made it a point to ask how they assessed their victims before they acted out. Over and over three things stood out, how their victims looked (frail, weak, not athletic), their overall situational awareness (never go after someone who sees you first), and their arm swing (vigorous arm movement or passive subdued). And so to a criminal, our own intra-species predators, as Robert Hare would call them, how the shoulders look is a key factor for those who seek to prey on us. As one psychopath said to me, and this was very telling, “silverbacks don’t go after silverbacks, they go after everything else.” Good point.
http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/spy ... y-about-us
And the almighlty zogler strikes again.

Perfectly described my thoughts, provided added resources.


I'm so in love right now ...

Hats off to you Mr Z.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2014 11:29 pm 
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Quote:
I AGREE WITH EVERYTHING ZOGLER SAID !!!!
Get used to it 8-)

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2014 6:09 am 
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Yeah, your right.

My initial read was correct that he was hater, but I seem to have a consistent flaw of layering extra stuff on top of intuition. And creating information that isn't there, this is pure projection.

I didn't mean a member of the elite, it would obviously not be that.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2014 7:35 am 
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Altair wrote:
Yeah, your right.

My initial read was correct that he was hater, but I seem to have a consistent flaw of layering extra stuff on top of intuition. And creating information that isn't there, this is pure projection.

I didn't mean a member of the elite, it would obviously not be that.
I figured the crux of matter would be reached in good time...well done, fellas. 8-)

Altair...push-ups. :lol:

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2014 10:02 am 
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The Kidd!! wrote:
Quote:
I AGREE WITH EVERYTHING ZOGLER SAID !!!!
Get used to it 8-)

ok. :)


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2014 10:40 am 
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Altair wrote:
Yeah, your right.

My initial read was correct that he was hater, but I seem to have a consistent flaw of layering extra stuff on top of intuition. And creating information that isn't there, this is pure projection.

I didn't mean a member of the elite, it would obviously not be that.
If you are intuitive you'll discard the rest as baggage this guys carries and gets manifested in your reality, thus baggage you still carry. No prob with that.
But you are aware of that. In fact you may well betsowed upon power he didn't even have, If he is a hater then what?L

[ img ]

Let it be. :ugeek:

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2014 8:39 pm 
The closest people I've met in person to anyone like us are basically "Old Symps" at the bar I go to as you can read a short blurb about in 21st CFSAP.

One of the guys is a cheeky little bastard and always gets to me. We've fucked some of the same women. He generally knows where the best locations are to post up, and since he owns the bar he works around me when I'm in those spots and accommodates me. Old Symp definitely. Maybe more? Unlikely. I'm actually learning that cheeky shit myself thanks to him.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2014 3:07 pm 
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I noticed that most of you here view all this as some sort of "competition".. Care to elaborate on your motivations in this ? I never saw it that way nor it seems interesting or entertaining to me


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2014 8:48 pm 
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fufe wrote:
I noticed that most of you here view all this as some sort of "competition".. Care to elaborate on your motivations in this ? I never saw it that way nor it seems interesting or entertaining to me
The ideal would be to be based purely on performance in a field. I am simply human though, and my ego is never completely absent. It doesn't play a role in a lot of decisions, but I do use it to fuel me to be better.

I for the most part try to fly under the radar, but in a situation like that I am not gonna go out my way to avoid it. If you try to fly under the radar when your in a direct confrontation like that you look weak. Weak is the last thing you want to look like there :geek:.

For example if I see someone trying to take up space or cut me off I will anticipate the action by looking ahead and side stepping the move. While making it look like I hadn't change my plan at all. I was moving anyways. That is good and shows you can keep your ego in check.

Not one for being a little bitch though, had he actually hit me. I would have made him wish he thought his decision through more carefully. And I am definitely not backing down from a direct in your face challenge like that. I don't care if people of the forum think I should.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2014 9:04 pm 
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Gotta understand man...you took HIS bait and played HIS game. Sure you may have thrown him off as he underestimated you while in cloak mode, but he still managed to 'force your hand'. :geek:

Going forward, remember it's always in your favor to be reactive rather than proactive. ;)

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Pimposophy Revisited is now finally available on Amazon in all territories!


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